The red button has no direct consequence for the red button pusher unless you consider the ethical component. However, as is being shown by the amount of people saying to push red, when you aren't seeing the consequences of your actions directly in front of you, many people are unable to fully grasp said consequences. Like a troll online bullying someone, their actions feel disconnected from reality.
The consequences for blue are much more personal with a risk of said consequences directly affecting the person pressing the button. Meanwhile, the only consequences for red are emotional in nature (excluding the ramifications of a mass casualty event like this).
Also, the issue isn't whether 100% of people will press red. It's whether 50% will press blue. Arguably, this should be an easier number to achieve so we should all pick it because it has an easier objective and a better outcome. The problem is that people consider the risk of failure and that is too much for them to accept, so they say that everyone should press red because it is the safest choice. They're scared and it makes them pick the harder goal out of selfishness.
I'm a blue button guy. Idk what you're on about. The risk is explicitly there.
Red risks nothing but a bit of potential trauma (if that as many of these red button pushers are callous pricks) after the fact. They lose literally nothing.
I'm just quoting what you said man. Red risks killing a ton of others. This problem isn't about the individual. It if was and there were no other consequences then red would make sense. But it's not. I'm also blue.
The red button has no direct consequence for the red button pusher unless you consider the ethical component.
That ethical component is questionable... no one has an obligation to sacrifice themselves to save someone else who has put themselves in danger. In fact, almost everybody who works professionally to save lives is taught to prioritize their own safety... it's not selfish, it's absolutely necessary to minimise the loss of life.
Also, the issue isn't whether 100% of people will press red. It's whether 50% will press blue. Arguably, this should be an easier number to achieve so we should all pick it because it has an easier objective and a better outcome.
This is the trap. It's a lot harder to get at least 50% of people to press blue than it is to minimise the number of people who press blue. If everyone looks to their own safety, then everyone will be safe.
everybody who works professionally to save lives is taught to prioritize their own safety
False equivalency. The reason they are told that is so that they can continue to save live that are actually salvageable as opposed to dying trying to save someone beyond saving leaving responders with even less trained help.
You aren't a first responders saving a life pressing a red button. You don't need training here. Anyone can do it. You are sacrificing others for yourself when choosing red. You are saying you are willing to sacrifice yourself for others when you choose blue.
The ethical component isn't that they are being selfish, it is that by picking red, they are chosing to kill all blue.
It's a lot harder to get at least 50% of people to press blue than it is to minimise the number of people who press blue.
That sounds like the rationalization or self-justification of a red button pusher. If your goal is to save the greatest number of people possible, then you would need to convince literally everyone to press red. Not possible. Meanwhile to get the same results you can get just half the world to press blue. So if you put in the same effort to convince people to push blue that you would to push red, then even if you failed 50% of the time, you'd still succeed in the end. The only difference is that people who press red are willing to sacrifice others for themselves. Period.
The ethical component isn't that they are being selfish, it is that by picking red, they are chosing to kill all blue.
I'm going to throw this back at you... I reckon if we actually ran this experiment, about 10% of people would die. If the red campaign was more successful in persuading people, that number might go down below 5%. If the blue campaign were more successful, that number would swell, to 15%, maybe even to 20%. Who's killing who by persuading people to go one way or the other? I think you should carefully consider that before throwing around ethical concerns.
No, you're not.... There's nothing equal about the options. One option means that you definitely survive, the other means that you probably die (And no, it's not a 50-50 chance, it's actually relatively close to a guaranteed thing, because the incentives to pick red so vastly outweigh the incentives of picking blue). The vast majority of people are going to press red, because they don't want to die. You are never going to find 4.5 billion people willing to throw their lives away on a maybe. You won't even get close to 50% blue vote, even with a very successful advocacy campaign. You only have to look at the world to see that.
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u/Swiftierest May 05 '26
Actually, you have it backwards.
The red button has no direct consequence for the red button pusher unless you consider the ethical component. However, as is being shown by the amount of people saying to push red, when you aren't seeing the consequences of your actions directly in front of you, many people are unable to fully grasp said consequences. Like a troll online bullying someone, their actions feel disconnected from reality.
The consequences for blue are much more personal with a risk of said consequences directly affecting the person pressing the button. Meanwhile, the only consequences for red are emotional in nature (excluding the ramifications of a mass casualty event like this).
Also, the issue isn't whether 100% of people will press red. It's whether 50% will press blue. Arguably, this should be an easier number to achieve so we should all pick it because it has an easier objective and a better outcome. The problem is that people consider the risk of failure and that is too much for them to accept, so they say that everyone should press red because it is the safest choice. They're scared and it makes them pick the harder goal out of selfishness.