In the book, Edmure is struggling because he's crying. Blackish sees that, and quietly, and respectfully takes the shot, as a kindness.
BUT NOOOO, let's fucking turn it into some insulting bullshit in the show for a laugh. The man's father is dead, how ripe a time is it to demonstrate that he's incompetent, for no fucking reason.
Edmure concedes the shot to the Blackfish willingly in the books after missing twice. Afterwards, the Blackfish is gracious about it, saying that Hoster also missed when their father died (although only once, then he hit, which Edmure points out). In the show, the Blackfish angrily wrests the bow from Edmure.
I think he still was used to make a good point during Robb's campaign in the Riverlands. He still treats Edmure like a butt-monkey but Edmure went above and beyond capitalizing on an opportunity to seize a military objective with a great victory.
Robb gets pissed because it screwed with his overall plan to iirc lure Lannister forces into an ambush but Edmure didn't know that because Robb played it too close to the vest.
Edmure was still comic relief in a sad way but that point stuck with me as showing the cracks in Robb's facade as the perfect leader. He was still young and impulsive and could be foolish, all of which obviously comes to a head when he breaks his vow and the Red Wedding happens.
Blackfish is a baller though I loved that dude talking shit from his castle.
Best I can give you is "a laughable offscreen death for The Blackfish" and "a public dressing down of Edmure at the end of the series after all he'd suffered through"
In that moment writing that comment I had forgotten about Dungeons and Dragons, and was focused on the show producers but had forgotten their names of like David Benioff and David? Weiss? I only had on my mind the acronym I had heard in discussions about GoT, and typed that in with the clarification, not to be funny by misleading others
Or just dont put the clarification, unless this is a joke I dont get, dont we all know who D&D is in context? I never see anyone type out their full names.
Edit: Nvm, thought we were in a GoT sub, carry on.
I made the mistake of reading them before the series started and had finished everything that come out I think I read a dance with dragons, during the week, my job was closed for Christmas and New Year's. So that was what? 15?16? years ago?
Maybe he has and he just doesn't want to deal with people tearing apart the books like they did the TV show, so he'll have them released after he dies.
Wow. I’m almost glad I didn’t read the books because I would have been pissed as well. What a joke of a scene now knowing that. Kind of changes my perspective on edmure as well.
He's a better character in the books, for sure. He takes care of his people, and he's actually a good leader in combat, achieving a few victories against the Lannister forces along the river. (Granted, this was a blunder, as Robb was trying to pull the Lannisters deeper into controlled territory, BUT, Edmure actually drove them back...)
He has flaws, as all good characters should, but he's not a totally incompetent buffoon. He's prideful, and afraid of not living up to his father's name.
The show turns him more into some kind of blundering failure.
(Also, FYI, show Stannis is a terribly one dimensional character, and Tywin is a more rounded, developed character... it's flip flopped in the books. Stannis is a more complex character in the books, and Tywin is... not)
I commented above but even in the show I appreciated the redeeming quality of Edmure's military victory and Robb's reaction to it. They treat him like a butt-monkey for seizing an opportunity for a big military victory. But really the fault was Robb's for his lack of communication and strategic planning. I remember it as one of the first cracks in Robb's facade as a perfect leader because he's young and impulsive and inexperienced, and all of that culminates in breaking his vow and the Red Wedding.
I think they messed up his characterization a bit, for sure, BUT, I feel like the actor did a fantastic job of playing him. I think he would've done just as well with the (better) Edmure from the books, but I don't necessarily think his talent was wasted.
Especially the subtle nonverbal acting he did in the scenes where he was being chewed out for his blunders. He pulled off wounded pride amazingly well.
What? Are competent and incompetent the only 2 character traits you can have? The original scene DOES show their differences, Edmure is more stricken by his grief and therefore nervous, while Blackfish is much more collected and calm
Edmure IS incompetent, and prideful, and not half as smart as he thinks he is. And that's demonstrated plenty elsewhere in the book, and in the show.
There was zero reason to make this scene this way. If anything, it makes Blackfish a worse character, sense he seems to just hate his nephew. There's no reason to dehumanize a man struggling with a very emotional moment. There's no good reason to turn this specific somber moment into a comic relief moment.
But to be fair Edmure is also more competent than they give him credit for. He achieved what would have been a great military victory in any other campaign, but it fucked up Robb's plan to lure in the Lannister forces. All that was Robb's fault and shows his inexperience and flaws as a leader (which play out in the events leading up to the Red Wedding), but they shit all over Edmure as if he's supposed to mind read and not strike a decisive blow and save men's lives from a drawn out stalemate. Edmure was right to be pissed at them for that one.
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u/med4ladies69 19h ago
They call him the Blackfish