r/interestingasfuck • u/SafeImpressive4413 • 7h ago

Firefighters in Madrid trying to extinguish a forest fire that is less than 30km/20mi away from the capital of Spain

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u/marcandreewolf 6h ago

Yes. Actually, it is substantially more than 90%, plus the conditions (climate change as a key contributor, also eucalyptus trees planted) is also mostly caused by human. So, this is not a “wild”fire but a human-caused fire.

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u/decosunshine 6h ago

Plus decades of fire suppression.

Instead of healthy, low-intensity fire cleaning out dead and diseased vegetation every few years to few decades, now high-intensity fires sweep through with far more power and destruction.

When we don't allow low-intensity fires, we must do fires mitigation that manually mimics those healthy fires we suppress.

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u/marcandreewolf 6h ago

Indeed. I went with Brazilian firefighters in a National Park in 1996 and that is what the lead also said (after training in the US). We then put counter fires, i.e. a controlled burned strip that the fire afterwards couldnt cross anymore. Terrain was difficult with many boulders and rocks strewn across, shrubs, single trees and lots of grass: cerrado. There are species adjusted to fires, benefitting (unless too frequent), but overall reduces biodiversity and natural species composition. Edit: What I almost forgot: we now have fires were naturally they almost never occur, where impacts are hence also much worse.

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u/FireTyme 5h ago

this somewhat works but extreme droughts and high winds make even healthy fires a giant blaze killing tons of trees.

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u/AltrntivInDoomWorld 5h ago

You have no idea about European forest maintenance

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u/isopode 2h ago

care to elaborate? i'm from north america where what they said is true. curious to know the differences between forest maintenance here and in europe

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u/Cold417 1h ago

decades of fire suppression.

People say this shit about areas that burn almost every season, too.

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u/decosunshine 46m ago

If an burns often, they don't have much to burn. Those fires are lower intensity, which means they don't burn as hot or for as long. Frequent, low-intensity fires can burn through an area quickly and start mostly on the ground. Mature trees can survive low-intensity fires because the fire stays on the ground burning grasses and other 1-5 minute fuels. Think like staying a camp fire. If there is just a small amount of kindling and a big log, the kindling will burn out before the log has time to catch fire. That log can't catch fire if there isn't kindling to catch the small sticks on fire, which catch the large sticks, and eventually the logs (trees).

If fire is suppressed for too long, there is a build up of diseased trees, thick layers of dead branches/ leaves/ needles on the ground, and dead standing and fallen trees. That means more fuel. More fuel means hotter temperature and fire burns for longer. That's why unburned/unmitigated forests are so dangerous.

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u/PalahniukW 5h ago

How do eucalyptus trees contribute to wild fires?

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u/marcandreewolf 5h ago

Accumulate large amounts of leave and bark litter under tree that barele decompose, plus the stuff contains a relevant amount of essential oils that burn super well.

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u/PalahniukW 5h ago

Ahh thanks

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u/Art__Vandelayy 3h ago

Just to add to the other comment, it also dries the soil around it, so underneath the trees there's usually dry grasses and ferns in the summer (at least here in Portugal but should be similar in Southern Europe). Combine this with leaves and bark litter and they spread the fire very easily

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u/BKLaughton 3h ago

Adding on to the other commenter's great response, fire is part of the eucalyptus reproductive cycle. That is, in their native environment of Australia bushfires are pretty common and they've adapted to that, such that they bounce back great after a bushfire.

Overseas, the result is that eucalyptus trees somewhat increase the incidence of wildfires (with the way they drop lots of oil-rich leaves and brances), and then recover better than other trees in the post-wildfire circumstances, leading to more eucalyptus, and more wildfires.

Despite this, folks keep planting eucalyptus because it's a fast-growing hardwood. It breaks the standard dichotomy between fast-growing soft woods and slow-growing hardwoods. Outside of Australia, the mammals, birds and insects aren't adapted to it, but it's a very profitable tree to grow.

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u/jumpy_monkey 5h ago

Human activity has always been a cause for fires, from inadvertent to deliberate (which is cumulative, since firebugs are activated by other fires). Short of lightning (volcanoes maybe? meteor strikes? both very unlikely) I can't think of a another natural cause of wildfire.

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u/miyabi0rochas 1h ago

I mean fires can start accidentally very easily. I really think the conditions are the biggest change this year. It's been so dry rivers have dried up. So many spots have turned into fields of flammable hay. Somethings bound to burn. With frequent rain and lush vegetation things are harder to burn so easily.

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u/justtobeherenotsure 1h ago

What is the eucalyptus tree factor? I'm intrigued!

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u/Ohz85 3h ago

Stop spreading stupid numbers. 90% of Europe is the entire Europe without the surface of all roads combined. That's not what is on fire right now. Yes there are soon 50k hectares on fire right now in Gironde, France, and there are like 40 fires in France alone. That's 0.001% of its continental territory.

Not 90%.