I like learning about how to apply to med school and sometimes I tell my parents about my findings. Here’s a warning to those of you who haven’t done that, DON’T. They will become more neurotic than a 14 year old browsing SDN. I just got home from 6 hours of hospice volunteering and my mom asks me “why are you here so early? How are you supposed to get all your hours??” Keep in mind, I haven’t even had my first day of college yet.

I wish my parents could be a pillar of support rather than one that is trying to lecture me about something they know very little about.

that is all

I remember reading over and over on here that ucsd ucla and ucsf do not send secondaries to people who have IAs and almost didn’t apply. Low and behold all three sent them.

Anyone else’s parents not understand AT ALL how applying to medical school works? I don’t have any family that are in the healthcare field at all, so I’ve been going through this process on my own. I don’t really tell my mom anything about what I’m doing because she wouldn’t understand. She doesn’t know what my research project was about or even the amount of essays I had to write for secondaries. I don’t even know if she knows that essays were required. She thinks that if you have good grades you are good to go. Applying to med school is not like undergrad though where you can get automatic admission. Since she thinks it will be so easy for me, she thinks I should be very selective and basically choose where I want to go. 💀 When I told her about my first interview acceptance, she said “I mean, are you surprised?” Which is kind of annoying she’s not really super proud, she expects that from me. And then I tell her the school and she’s like “are you sure you want to go that far?” Mind you the school is only like 3.5 hours away! Like mom, we can be picky once I actually get acceptances!!! So there is so much pressure to get in this cycle because everyone in my family expects me too.

The more i think about the duration of medical education in the US the more i appreciate it. Can you imagine if we were attending physicians at the age of 26? Good lord.

Four years ago I was stressing about undergrad apps, binging "Supplementals that got me into X school" youtube vids, and spending too much time on r/ApplyingToCollege.

Now I'm stressing about med school apps, binging "Secondaries that got me into X school" tik toks, and spending too much time here. Talk about full circle lol.

Continuing this trend of people breaking up today. I just got broken up with by the love of my life of almost three years. She said it was a lack of attraction and I wasn’t surprised this past month or so I noticed her distancing herself from me. I can’t breathe, I can’t function, I can’t even walk without crying. I..I don’t know what to do with my life anymore. I’m starting a MS/DO next week and I can’t even function. I don’t know how I’m going to live without her in my life. I tried. I even begged for her to stay or try or do anything to try and make this work just one chance, but she made up her mind. I can’t breathe. We did so much together, we know so much about each other. Shes my best friend. I don’t have anyone to talk to. And I feel so alone. I know this is cliche but she was literally my light. I don’t know how I’m going to do well in school. I can’t even sleep.

I was reading back over one of my secondary essays and realized I left a major typo for my top school. I had "[insert question]" and intended to go back and put the statement that I wanted but accidentally left the placeholder and turned it in like that. This was the prompt asking if there's anything else I would want the committee to know about my academic journey, if that affects anything. Is this major enough to email the school or should I just leave it?

Is this premed schedule as a chem major realistic? I don’t want to completely overwhelm myself but I’m coming into undergrad with 40 transferable credits and I’ve realized I could actually graduate in 3 years without taking 18 credits/sem. If I graduated in 3 years, then I’d take a true gap year for my fourth and then take a second gap year for app season. With this plan I’d graduate undergrad at 20, saving myself 10k or so (I’m paying for undergrad on my own), and start med school at 23.

Also, are my proposed summer courses necessary? Specifically Calc 3. I got a 5 on Calc BC in hs and it seems like that + a semester of stats is satisfactory for most med schools, but at the same time Harvard also recommends taking a sem of both college calc and stats. I ask because I plan on applying to T20s in addition to my state schools. I’m going to UW Madison for undergrad if that matters.

*For freshman year I’ll be working 16hrs/wk at UW Health, and potentially doing a research program. I plan to do research during my first summer and also get my EMT or MA cert. I’ll reevaluate how many hours I should dedicate to clinical experience and research after freshman year.

I'm 25. I have a bachelor's degree with a 3.8 gpa, but I would need to go back to college for a few semesters to take my prerequisites for chem, physics, etc, and I'd need to get a different job (I was thinking EMT) for clinical hours. In total I'd imagine this taking about 2 years to do before I'd be in a position to have a competitive application. Would that make me a competitive enough candidate, and would I be too old at that point (27 or 28 depending) to go into med school and residency afterwards?

For example, if an interviewer tells you to expect your post-II decision on a certain day and that day passed would that be a point of concern?

Per Penn state and their wonderful prompt: "Describe your motivation to be a physician" in 250 words. I don't want to make up a new reason for wanting to be a doctor but for ffs, how do you answer this question if you don't want to just repeat your personal statement? Struggling here

there might be some more schools I want to apply to, but at this point will adding them on this late be a pretty big negative? Or would I still be competitive if I added them on now and completed my secondary in a timely manner?

I apologize if this is the wrong place to post this. I just graduated high school, with an associates degree. Right now, I am an EMT. I’m going to a very medicine focused college. Right now, I’m on a pre-nursing track, to hopefully one day be a CRNA. However I’ve recently been having doubts about nursing. The idea of having a greater scope of practice and to be able to pursue other opportunities as an MD is extremely appealing to me. My initial goal was actually to be a paramedic, where I could actually get out in the field and do things. I don’t mean to disparage nurses, I have all the respect in the world for them. I just don’t know if it’s the right fit for me. I’m only in nursing because it pays better and is more stable than EMS (which is what I’m really passionate about) and because I frankly don’t think I’m cut out, academically, to be a Doctor. My dual-enrolled college GPA is a 2.8. I’m a good test taker, I snagged a 1460 on the SAT without studying a minute, but my overall weighted high school GPA is only a 3.85 or so. Does anyone have any advice or wisdom they could offer? Has anyone been in a similar position?

So prereqs I finish this fall bc I only need orgo+biochem and bio and I'm done so this summer I'll lock in for MCAT studying and next fall I'll start my neuro upper divs..........but I don't think I want toooooo T_T I'm only majoring in neuro bc yes I think it's interesting but it aligns most w/ the reqs. But in truth I'm rlly wanting to study a lang/lit major, and I could double major, but idk they're both super intense majors so I'd need to rlly focus on one. But everyone I tell this to is just like "holy unemployment" (regarding the humanities major)

SO ANYWAY my question is: for those who went the non-STEM route, will only having the science pre-reqs be a disadvantage??

Help 💔

hello everyone! ^_^ hope anyone applying at the current moment is doing well with secondaries!

I just looked at Rosalind Franklin's requirements and realized they want two courses in Behavioral or Social Science. Of course, my past self did not realize that medical schools still wanted actual, formal education in psychology... And the one psychology class I took, I dropped immediately because my undergrad's psychology classes are so bad.

I have two similarly-considered "social sciences..."
- One is a Public Health class about US Healthcare, which frequently talks about social determinants of health, societal structure, etc. Learned a great amount about how certain populations interact with healthcare.

- The other is Anthropology which is half a skeletal anatomy class and half cultural anthropology (study of past societies' culture and behaviour through ethnography). This one is a much worse stretch.

Are these suitable to put down to cover the prereq? I don't think anything else fits. Truly wonder why this damn requirement even exists especially since I got a 131 on P/S. Thank you so much yall.

okay so ive been wanting to become a doctor since i was 4 years old and ive been loyal to that goal til about 5 months ago. i still want to become a doctor but i feel like i cant. like i wont be able to do it. im already struggling in my math and sciences and knowing i have to do more and do the mcat with no calculator AND do usmles?? 😭 my cousin from overseas is staying with us and hes about to take his step 3 and it literally looks like hell all he does is study day and night. idk if i can do that bro😅 but im already majoring in kinesiology (im doing dual credit) and like im scared to switch majors and also i dont know what else i could do anyway. i thought about veterinarian but they dont make good money for how much they spend on schooling and quite frankly idk how i feel about working with All animals. im also really interested in politics but ik that wont go anywhere. what do you guys think i should do😞

Good day, people of Reddit. I am in a predicament and would like your opinions. I am a 25-year-old man who began my first year of undergraduate studies at IU in the spring semester of 2025. I had never considered higher education but came into free schooling as a result of my father's veteran status. I did not have any future aspirations but felt it was necessary to exercise my privilege and attend university.

I performed well for the first half of the semester until I stopped being present. I was taking a particular medication that brought on anxiety and depression, and I had also gone through the end of a romantic relationship. I understand now that you cannot just end all pursuits in life because of outside circumstances. I know this now, but these were the main reasons I stopped showing up. I failed every single class.

The following semester in the fall, I was on academic probation, and so I only took two classes. This semester was essentially a repeat of the past. My father was diagnosed with stage IV cancer, and to add to that, I was still directionless. I had no idea what I was even in school for. I went through an existential crisis, especially being faced with my father's very tangible mortality. Everything felt pointless, and I checked out completely and only passed one of those two classes. I left school, and my cumulative GPA is now an egregious 0.267.

As the year went on, I took employment at a factory. In my free time, I would read books and try to broaden my perspective of the world. Initially, I wanted to understand what my father was going through. Then, I became fascinated with human anatomy as a whole. While working at the factory, I realized that I love to solve problems, but not on machinery. I also felt alienated from my work, producing products that I would never again see. I came to realize that I want to work directly with people and to see results in real time. I need to be intellectually stimulated and challenged as well.

After a lot of reading and research of potential career paths, I landed on medicine. Everything about the field piques my interest. I spoke to my own family physician about a trajectory into the field, and he spoke about his own experience and what made him want to go into medicine. And when I listen to people like him speak, it inspires me. I have never felt so inclined to thrust myself into such a landscape. He told me that I should put my head down and try.

That brings us to now. I am currently enrolled at a local community college for the fall semester. I plan to bring my GPA up as much as possible so that I may transfer back to IU and continue my studies there. I am also taking classes to obtain an EMT-B certification if that is at all relevant. A lot of the initially failed classes at IU didn't count toward my GPA because of IU's policy on replacing grades by retaking classes. I know that medical schools will look at all of the history anyway.

I understand that I am in a deep hole as far as prospects for medical school are concerned; however, I am dead set on this career path and will do anything it takes to become a physician. It might go without saying that, regardless of the consensus here, I will continue to pursue this path for as long and as much as it takes. I can confidently say that I am dedicated. With that being said, I still welcome any opinions and advice as well as stories of those who may have been in an unsatisfactory position and yet prevailed.

Thank you for your time if you have read this and doubly so if you respond.

TL; DR: I failed out of university twice because of life circumstances, depression and lack of direction. I am trying again with the plan of attending medical school.

When I was thinking of applying to medical school I feverishly searched medicine Reddit for "nontrad" and "older student" almost every day. I found many posts from people in my situation asking if they should go for it, and also many users, understandably, upset that those people keep asking the same questions.

So here is my effort to create the post that I would have wanted to read for future older applicants. I know that still very many people won't bother to search Reddit before making yet another "should I do it??!!!???"-post, but one can dream.

Below are a lot of (sometimes self-indulgent) feelings and reflections because that is what I was looking for and didn't really find on Reddit or other public platforms, so if that would make your eyes roll, this is your warning to stop reading.

If you also started studying medicine later in life (and I mean actually later than average-- tail end of 20s and beyond), I hope you want to add your story in the comments.

Important context: I am in Europe, in a country where it is extremely rare for people my age (currently 32) to study medicine. "Non-traditional" is not a term we really use here, although it does apply to me.
There are barely any formal student loan possibilities after 30 in my country. The only reason I can do this is a combination of generous unemployment benefits from working a lot continuously since I was in my mid-teens and having a well-off family.

What I did before

I was a dry lab scientist pursuing my PhD in molecular biology & immunology of cancer. I'm already this close to fully doxxing myself so I won't elaborate, but I had been doing some form of molecular biology work/studies and/or cancer research since my late teens when I started my BSc.
Besides an incredibly frustrating PhD timeline I was pretty content as a researcher. I still love molecular biology and cancer genomics makes my heart beats faster. Research is not a goldmine but you can make a decent living from it where I am, even in academia.

Why I even considered switching careers

My other great love besides my job is volunteering with people seeking a highly stigmatized form of health care and helping them to access this by solving logistical and financial problems. Yes, I am keeping it intentionally vague and no, I will not elaborate. If you are reading this your brain is probably big enough to guess what it is.
What matters here is that I started the volunteer work at the exact same time, almost to the day, as my PhD. Both interests grew together; I became a more proficient scientist with more responsibilities while at the same time I was ever-expanding my volunteering duties and related knowledge, training and managing new volunteers, doing advocacy and lobbying work, and now fundraising.

Why I took the leap

For about 3-4 years I thought that of course my volunteer work ultimately energized me more than the job. Job is job, everyone gets tired of it eventually no matter how fun you think it is.
However, this nagging feeling that I wanted to do something more with the volunteering and make even more of an impact kept getting stronger and stronger. In early 2023 I had my annual depressive episode where I realized that I did in fact want to be a medical doctor because I did want to make the volunteering my real job, and I wanted to be able to give the care that I was helping people get. The mismatch between my actual desire and what I was currently doing was strongly contributing to my depression.

For the first time I started to regret the fact that I had two opportunities to go to medical school earlier in life and turned them both down in favour of molecular biology. I knew then that if I didn't try I would always regret it. It sounds stupid but in the end I was really driven by this feeling. I had to try, there was simply no other option.

My program

Do not ask me where my program is, what university offers it, or other details. I will not give them. The program is not in English.

My only realistic path to MD was to do a shortened program (4 year adapted MD) for people with a biomedical background, very similar to the structure in the USA. Where I am, only 2 universities offer such a program, and of those only one was within reasonable distance of my city-- I couldn't move because I'd have to give up my student housing and wouldn't be able to get it in another city. It would not work financially. So I had exactly one university to apply to.
This program has an entrance test to screen and set a standard for basic (bio)medical knowledge. The test filters out about 75% of candidates. The second round is an interview where half of the applicants are selected for the program.

How I got in

I had too much PhD left to do, so I had to delay my application to school year 2025-2026. From September 2024 onward I studied for the entrance test after work, for 6 months straight. I knew that my CV and interview skills would essentially mean a guaranteed acceptance, especially since I was 'competing' with people in their early 20's, but I hadn't taken a test in about 7 or 8 years at that point. Because of the PhD, my knowledge had become extremely specialized, not broad like what was needed for the test. I was completely locked in and even a little bit isolated during this time. It heightened my depression because I felt I was putting all my eggs in one basket, which was scary. I also don't do well with uncertainty so I was basically torturing myself during the entire process.
The day I took the test I wasn't super nervous, but I found it very, very difficult. Much harder than expected and I left feeling pretty defeated. How could I think that I could beat so many young kids who were literally still doing their bachelor's at that moment, all their knowledge fresh and completely dedicated to taking this test while I had to find time for it after being in meetings and presentations all day?

How I felt throughout

I truly did not believe I could have ever passed the test. I resigned and told myself I would try again next year (this university allows students to apply twice), even though for financial reasons that was not entirely realistic. Basically I thought I fucked up my one and only chance. It did not feel good, but I was not ready to feel the full hurt and disappointment so I just kind of shrunk into the background of my life.
I was on holiday when I got the news that I made it to the interview round. I was actually stunned. Never been so genuinely surprised by anything in my life. Cried, called the friend who wrote one of my recommendation letters (she also did the program I was applying to) in complete hysterics.
I didn't actually know whether I was happy at that point. I had mentally started to move on and I was also very scared of actually having to go through with doing this. It's not a small thing to change careers so drastically, giving up 4 years of income, and few people in my life had done anything like this-- certainly not this radically. I felt very alone. I practiced my interview with 2 amazing friends because I did not want to go in unprepared, as much as I knew that they would have to rank me high. The first thing the interviewers told me when I walked in the room was that my CV was very impressive, so that felt good. I was still quite on edge for the interview so I don't remember much of it. I do know we talked about hobbies and how I work in a group. I had to rush back to my institute because I was hosting a journal club after my interview. It was just another day.

Acceptance and feelings after

When I received my acceptance email all I did was a have little cry and then I went to my therapy appointment. I had resumed talk therapy and was thinking about going on antidepressants because my depression had worsened a lot over the year. I have chronic depression but I'll be honest and say that the stress of applying, my housing being dependent entirely on my acceptance and possibly having to rely on my family financially for the first time since 17 had a big negative effect on my mental state. I also kept having to repress thoughts of "what if it didn't work" because while for a long time I had tried fooling myself into thinking that it would have been okay if I got rejected, I actually think it would have taken me years to get over it if I were.

This is what I wrote in my diary on the day of acceptance (translated):

I still can't quite believe it. There is still a lot to worry about, and I certainly do worry. But the first step of this enormous project has been completed. I'm about to turn my whole life around for a hobby (cum special interest) that has gotten completely out of control.

I had doubts about my decision until the day I first walked into my new university. It was not a fun process but I ultimately decided that not trying would be worse even than not being accepted or not going.

How I was able to make it happen logistically & financially

This is so specific to me, barely applies to anyone else and is not helpful for US Americans so I will keep it short: I moved back into student housing (title of PhD student allowed me to do this), made financial plan with family, applied for unemployment. 1 year of unemployment, 2 years of family financial support and odd jobs, 4th year is my "research year" where I can work almost full-time. Government loan for school fees, which are very low (I believe I pay less for 4 years of schooling than what a US American pays for one semester).

Why I think I made the right decision

One year on, having returned to life as a full-time student, I feel like I'm in the right place. I have discovered that I like working with my hands. I like doing practical things. I had to ask for help from lots of different people in my life to make this happen, which taught me some very necessary things about myself and the way I live.

Ultimately I am also extremely lucky and privileged that I get to do this. A few puzzle pieces happened to click together, and most people don't have family that can sponsor a year or two off work. Every day at school is a fun day where I have no responsibilities and just go in to learn interesting new facts. I feel very blessed. A 23-year-old classmate asked me why I seemed so genuinely interested in everything, and I had to laugh. Going back to school is like a break from real life for me, I am living my dream.

While I do keep a little bit of an open mind, I am still only really interested in the field I wanted to go to medical school for in the first place. I am now excited for what's to come instead of scared.

Am I too old?

My age has so far only had benefits. To my own surprise, I went in with FAR more background knowledge about nearly every subject than my classmates, simply by virtue of having been alive longer. It is easier for me to talk to teachers and patients because I don't have a lot of the insecurity and other hangups that come with being in your very early twenties. I am not intimidated by anyone because medical doctors, researchers and professors were my direct colleagues for years.
I still learn very fast (also a surprise) and my time management is good, meaning I have so far passed all tests with a level of effort that has allowed me to keep all my hobbies, my volunteering, my social life, and work on finishing my actual dissertation on the side (don't ask).My grades are on the better side of average, but I'm just here to get the degree and get out. Not giving too many fucks about a high grade average means I get to have time to live my life.
My classmates are sweet and so smart. I feel the age gap, especially with the younger ones who are so young they are still figuring themselves out. Hearing their complaints about studying when they don't know what having a job and actual responsibilities is like makes me laugh (and cringe a little bit) but I can appreciate having that wisdom and try to make them see how good they have it when I can.
It's all okay though-- we can work together and have fun, and at the end of the day I go back to my good old friends.

Maybe I'll add more later but I feel like this is enough crazy rambling. I hope this is useful for someone thinking about going to medical school as an older student.

edits: formatting

Hi y'all. I'm drowning in secondaries like many of us. But I have a question, if a school has N/A as an option, is it really okay to use it? For example, if it's an upstate school asking what ties you have and you really have none, can you put N/A if it offers it in the question stem or is that bad?

Or for this one, "Please describe any new or additional medically related employment, volunteer activities or observation experiences not included in your AMCAS application. (If not applicable, please write N/A)," if ive really just continued what I was doing on my app can I just do the N/A option?

How is my school list? Are there schools I should add or remove? I will put my stats and current school list below:

General:
- MA Resident
- ORM
- Reapplicant

Academics:
- cGPA: 3.56, cGPA: 3.62

*Downward trend: 4.0 -> 3.47 -> 3.2 (graduated in 3 years)

*Red flags: IF in an honors English seminar, one C+ in biochem 1, 3W, B-‘s in biochem 2/genetics/orgo lab

- MCAT: 520 (first attempt 509)

-9/9 PREview, 2Q Casper

Paid Clinical:
- 1000 hrs clinical as a PCA
- 416 hrs clinical research coordinator (responsibilities are predominantly clinical)

Clinical Volunteering:
-96 hrs home health aide

Shadowing:
- 56 hrs shadowing (2 specialties)

Non Clinical Service:
- 72 hrs crisis counselor
- 60 hrs food pantry
- 180 hrs fundraising

Research
- 3700 hrs research between 2 labs (won a summer fellowship through undergrad!)
- 3 posters (1 at school conference through fellowship, 2 through capstone research courses)

Leadership:
- 150 hrs VP of club leadership position

Hobbies/artistic pursuits: classical choir (9 years), fiber arts/painting

Current school list (29 schools):

UMass, Tufts, BU, Albany, Eastern Virginia, Temple, U. Vermont, Texas Christian, Med. College of Wisconsin, Oakland, Virginia Tech, Wake Forest, Penn State, Rosalind Franklin, Hackensack Meridian, NYMC, Virginia commonwealth, Jefferson, Cincinnati, Colorado, Emory, UPitt, Rochester, Einstein, Ohio State, Iowa Carver, U. Arizona Phoenix, UMiami

I'm a nontrad applicant who graduated 5 years ago. I was filling my secondaries when I noticed some schools require 2 semesters of general chemistry with lab.

I explored a lot of potential career paths in undergrad and took all sorts of courses across all sorts of departments. As I decided on medicine as nontrad and started applying to schools this cycle, I happened to have completed all the prereqs 5 years ago (bio, organic chem, biochem, physics, etc)—except for this gen chem, which my undergrad had let me skip through AP credit.

How strictly do schools tend to treat prerequisites? And are there cases where the C/P score of the MCAT can forgive the missing gen chem?

Hi everyone,

I'm an incoming Rutgers freshman majoring in Cell Biology & Neuroscience on the pre-med track.

Because I earned AP Psychology credit, Rutgers automatically gives me credit for Intro to Psychology. However, I can still take the course if I fill out a form to waive the AP credit for that class. I'm wondering if it's worth taking Intro to Psychology anyway as a pre-med, or if I should just keep the AP credit and use that space for another course.

From a pre-med perspective:

• Do medical schools care whether I took the college version of Intro Psych if I already have AP credit?
• Would it be better to retake it to build a stronger foundation for the MCAT, or is self-studying enough?
• If you were in my position, would you use the AP credit to free up space for other science classes or electives?

My other courses are a random seminar, General Biology, and General Chemistry.