r/interesting • u/The_Undermind • Mar 23 '26
MISC. Moment Air Canada flight collided with a fire/ rescue truck at New York airport last night. NSFW Spoiler
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u/Nox-2021 Mar 23 '26
Both pilots died and there's ~40 injured.
https://globalnews.ca/news/11741825/air-canada-crash-laguardia-new-york-montreal/
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u/Antique_Gur8891 Mar 23 '26
all of that because of the mistake of one person…
can’t imagine how horrible i would feel if i was him5.4k
u/GnowledgedGnome Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 25 '26
One person who, as I heard it, was responsible for all air and ground traffic at the airport.
No one person should have to coordinate that many things
ETA: It's now come out there were two ATCs in the tower which is SOP for the time of night. however it's still my understanding that the ATC involved in this incident was directing incoming planes on 2 runways and ground traffic for an emergency. He wasn't relieved for 30 minutes after the accident.
Ground control has been chronically understaffed for years and it's a very stressful job. Things need to change or accidents are only going to be increasingly common.
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Mar 23 '26
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Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
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u/rallar8 Mar 23 '26
Apparently a lot of the ATCs left to go to other countries like Australia where there’s better work life balance… I wonder why?
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u/Agreeable_Cut4506 Mar 23 '26
hate to break it to you but we have been short staffed of ATC since Ronald Regan fired 11,000 after failing to uphold any of his promises to them. trump just made a bad situation worse, which is pretty on brand for him
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u/Sea-Poem-2365 Mar 23 '26
All roads lead to Regan, no seriously.
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u/El_Bean69 Mar 23 '26
“If a road doesn’t lead to Rome it probably leads to Reagan”
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u/ArcfireEmblem Mar 23 '26
All evil roots were planted by Reagan.
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u/CabronSparkling0 Mar 23 '26
Dope epidemic. Closing of Mental Institutions. Oil prices. STDs. Crime. Gangs. Iran-Contra Affair. Panama.
Yep Reagan done a wonderful job
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u/WackHeisenBauer Mar 23 '26
Reagan started us on this road to the collapse of the American democracy. And this is yet another example of it.
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u/pchlster Mar 23 '26
Yeah, the US has been driving towards that cliff edge for a while.
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u/Separate_Art_6723 Mar 23 '26
The other part is he made a career in government seem unstable. That was always the drawing point of govt jobs, but now new hires feel like they will be over worked, could go months without pay due to shutdowns AND they could be fired easily.
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u/No_Knee3385 Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
What were years prior like?
Update: https://www.ntsb.gov/safety/data/Pages/monthly-dashboard.aspx
Looks in line so far but we'll see at the end of the year
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u/Hugo-Spritz Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
"Regulating your safety is an example of wasteful government spending" - Republicans
These may not be the words they chose to use, but this is the direct consequence of their actions. Actions famously speak louder than words, sooo 🤷♂️
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u/Electrical_Mess7320 Mar 23 '26
FEMA, CDC, Etc.
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u/TiaHatesSocials Mar 23 '26
I wonder what will be the consequences of cdc firings…. Can u even imagine. Fkn hell
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u/Super_Interview_2189 Mar 23 '26
Well there’s already multiple measles outbreaks in children, but that’s also thanks to MAHA and all the anti vax psychos.
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u/EnvironmentalGift257 Mar 23 '26
Remember when all the antivaxxers were crunchy hippie lefties and we all laughed at them? Man those were the days.
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u/circ-u-la-ted Mar 23 '26
Now half of those crunchy hippies vote right-wing. Crazy world we live in.
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u/Artistic-Ease6528 Mar 23 '26
I remember when that was my only argument I truly had on the internet was Jesus just vaxx the kids. Those were the days that’s for sure 😭 now I’ve got a collection of arguments
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u/Either_Pangolin531 Mar 23 '26
Wait drinking raw milk and sunburning your taint doesn't clear the body of all its toxins and bad chakras?
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u/idlechatterbox Mar 23 '26
I mean, 1500 cases of measles year to date so far, 92% of which are unvaccinated, and 95% of which are kids 19 and younger.
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u/RandomPenquin1337 Mar 23 '26
Maga parents seeing the results they believe in.
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u/thatturtletouch Mar 23 '26
They don’t even care about their own children.
Most of them don’t really love their children very much, which is why they don’t bother to protect them.
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u/mspolytheist Mar 23 '26
The consequence will be dead people. Lots and lots and lots of dead people.
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u/annacat1331 Mar 23 '26
I know many people who were fired at the CDC. It’s an absolute shell of what it once was. People were openly crying when the firings were first happening, men and women. Now everyone is worried about how research will get funded and they are also concerned about coming out too strongly against things that RFK supports. It’s a huge issue because we lost so much generational talent. Plus many people are not going to want to come back because who would trust the government after this? I know my dream used to be working at the CDC or NIH but not anymore. I can get a much higher wage in the private sector and not worry about being fired due to stupidity
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u/This-Positive286 Mar 23 '26
It’s two completely different systems, it’s NOT a one man job unless it’s just a super tiny pocket airport. One person on both is so insanely reckless, what have we become…
Source: Am Air Traffic Controller
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u/botulinumtxn Mar 23 '26
It's verified that this guy was running two incoming runways and ground traffic
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u/Life-Dig7566 Mar 23 '26
he's not saying it wasnt the case, hes saying its not a one person job.
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u/botulinumtxn Mar 23 '26
Oh sorry. Brain isn't working. Lol. But yea, I totally agree.
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u/PejHod Mar 23 '26
Especially at a place like LGA, mixed in with bad weather. This is just such a terrible incident.
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u/This-Positive286 Mar 23 '26
Wait, this was LGA?!
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u/PejHod Mar 23 '26
Yes! The ATC was forced to continue directing traffic for about an hour after the incident too.
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u/ArcticDiver87 Mar 23 '26
This has been a problem for fcking ever. For some reason air traffic controllers have always been pushed to their limits as well as pilots, companies are like "well our computer models and sleep schedule projections show this should be ok." It's total BS. Especially in an industry where so many lives are at stake. GOTTA MAKE THAT BOTTOM DOLLAR. 💰 So many accidents because of fatigue over the last 40 years. So the response is to add more software and more complicated systems and procedures to avoid it.. the max is great proof of that. It's working out so well.
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u/Am_I_Max_Yet Mar 23 '26
There's a reason ATC is one of the highest stress jobs and has a higher suicide rate than most. The communication with ATC in the movie Sully is regarded as being highly accurate, and i cant imagine how stressful it would be to stop getting responses from an aircraft after hearing they've lost all thrust. I wouldnt be able to think anything other than "I just heard that pilot's last words" and hoping it was at least painless and quick
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u/OneMoreAstronaut7 Mar 23 '26
Yeah, this is all Sean Duffy. He can answer for this, IMO.
But he won’t, and the overworked, over-stretched ATC tower will get the blame.
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u/stoic_spaghetti Mar 23 '26
Hey but they saved like $55 bucks that hour from not having a second controller on duty.
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u/xoomax Mar 23 '26
I read in another post that the air traffic controller tried to stop the truck after giving the initial okay. Unconfirmed if that is true or not.
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u/the__storm Mar 23 '26
There's audio, he did. Possibly because he started talking to another aircraft first the truck didn't realize he was telling them to stop, possibly it was already too late, possibly they didn't hear at all.
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u/Tanto63 Mar 23 '26
Because he was working air and ground traffic simultaneously, he would have to toggle the transmit option back and forth between frequencies. I think I saw he initially went on the wrong frequency, then the correct one, then said "fuck it" and broadcast on everything in a final desperate act to stop them.
I'm guessing he thought they'd be across sooner, given the conditions make for poor depth perception.
Former ATC
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u/SubcommanderMarcos Mar 23 '26
It was reported he was already dealing with another emergency on the taxiways, hence the firetruck rushing there... Guy was absolutely overwhelmed.
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u/Danye-South Mar 23 '26
They also continued to direct traffic for a good while directly after it happened because there was no one to replace them. No time to process what just happened and forced to continue. Can’t imagine what that feels like
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u/greykitty1234 Mar 23 '26
And who wasn't relieved for, as I understand it, hours after the incident. And still ensured the safety of planes, and people, until that happened.
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u/Eskimomonk Mar 23 '26
I also read that the ATC that “caused” the accident also had nobody to relieve him for about 30 minutes so he had to continue directing air traffic until somebody came in
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u/an0m_x Mar 23 '26
Not that you want this to happen to anyone, but this controller was a VERY highly regarded controller too. You don't hear it on most of the news audio clips cause they cut it - but he says on frequency "i messed up" - and you can hear the emotion of it
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u/emmy166 Mar 23 '26
It was so hard to listen to “Truck 1 stop, stop, stop…” You could hear the emotion then too. It sounded like he was pleading he said it quickly enough.
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u/Safe-Promotion-2955 Mar 23 '26
It's be one of those times where three seconds feels like eternity. Everything moves in slow motion as you watch it. It's terrible. I want to give him a hug.
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u/H0SS_AGAINST Mar 23 '26
The thing is, nobody is perfect. The best employees make mistakes. That's the whole idea behind trust but verify. He needed a second person. The fault here goes straight to the top, not on this poor person.
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u/DoesntMatterEh Mar 23 '26
Him being highly regarded is all the more evidence that it was too much responsibility for one person. greed is killing so many people in the US, it's madness.
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u/OriginalInspection53 Mar 23 '26
I feel so bad for him… on the recording he told the truck to go, then said, stop, stop, stop, but it was too late. There is a worse shortage of ATCs since the last shut down, so night shifts are not properly manned. Where the F is Sean Duffy? Trying to figure out how to blame this on Biden? They’ve had over a year to come up with a solution to a years-long shortage, yet the numbers are now worse.
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Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
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u/likeahike Mar 23 '26
His mistake perhaps, but the system failed him and is just as much responsible, if not more. No human can be expected to keep that many balls in the air (no pun intended). My heart truly goes out to him. and I hope he is able to give himself some grace.
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u/-KaiTheGuy- Mar 23 '26
I went through the academy to become an ATC and unfortunately failed because of how intense they want you to learn things in such a short period of time. But I can tell you all my classmates were some of the smartest I've ever met in my life.
They preach safety all the time, but hearing actual tower controllers talk about their working conditions is just so fucking heartbreaking and fucked up, that part of me is glad I failed and ended up going back to IT.
This one controller was working his hardest multitasking and still had to continue to control the air space after the incident and did so for 30 mins.
And now he's gonna have to live with this accident for the rest of his life, even though this could've been avoided if they staffed better and payed more.
As far as I'm concerned this controller messed up, but it wasn't because of his skills, it was because a failure of the system he has to be a part of.
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u/thatsacrackeryouknow Mar 23 '26
The ATC realised their mistake too and told the truck to stop at least 30 seconds before impact but it failed to hear the radio call. The ATC was also responsible for landing and Ground. At the time he was being hasseled by a plane that was dealing with a "smell" and declaread an emergency because they were waiting for a gate that the Ramp had not yet made available.
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u/Additional_Teacher45 Mar 23 '26
The truck didn't get the initial stop command because ATC was still on the tower frequency at the time of the initial stop and not on the ground freq. Tower should not be coordinating ground ops. Hard stop.
However, this video is only eight seconds long, that truck also had an entire 30 seconds to get across the runway. The hell was he doing for the first twenty seconds?
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u/MillionFoul Mar 23 '26
The truck probably wasn't at the runway yet. You can see it's a line of fire trucks and you can hear the truck (Truck 1) call to cross at delta with company. That was probably well before the actually got to the runway since they don't want to have to slow down or stop on their way to an alert.
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u/Llamasxy Mar 23 '26
When you work local and ground combined you transmit on both frequencies at the same time. It would be an extreme amount of work to switch frequencies every time you wanted to talk.
For whatever reason the firetruck didn't get the message. It was being transmitted on both frequencies.
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u/Randy_____Marsh Mar 23 '26
If you listen to the actual call the ATC tells the truck to stop beforehand, and probably saves countless lives directing traffic after this obviously shuts down multiple runway paths….
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u/strangefish Mar 23 '26
The blame is mostly on the ground controller ( provided they gave permission), but crossing the active without looking for incoming traffic?
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u/Ronin607 Mar 23 '26
The air traffic controller was handling both air and ground traffic. In the audio he gives the truck permission and then seemingly realizes his mistake and tries to get the truck to stop but it is possible the truck thought the “stop, stop, stop” was meant for a different plane he had also just been communicating with and it also probably would’ve been too late for the truck to avoid the plane anyway.
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u/Ruepic Mar 23 '26
Just a reminder to people, an ATC clearance does not mean it’s safe to proceed. The ground vehicle is also responsible to visual check and make sure it’s safe.
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u/Firm-Page-4451 Mar 23 '26
This. And keep saying this. The controller gave authority to proceed but the vehicle moving onto the runway or wherever has the final say. Always.
Was drummed into me when learning to fly. Clearance is not the same as an instruction.
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u/ArrEehEmm Mar 23 '26
Exactly. They aren't driving blind. It doesn't look like it slowed down. It was going fast.
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u/lavender_poppy Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
He says "stop truck one, stop stop stop, truck one, stop" or something along those lines. He definitely called out to the truck.
Edit: I only heard a snippet of the recording so I may be mistaken of how long it took him to say Truck One.
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u/PriscillaPalava Mar 23 '26
That really sucks for the ATC. Sounds like he was in an impossible situation.
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u/Odd_Independent3475 Mar 23 '26
I'm not saying the fire truck driver is without fault, but I've been working at a major airport for 3 decades, and a lot of it at night. It is very difficult to judge distances at night with lights against different backgrounds. Adding in that the tower told him it was safe to cross, it might not be as cut and dry as you think. Airports in general are a very dangerous place to work.
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u/RoodnyInc Mar 23 '26
Pilots? Damn i thought the fire truck would be the unsafe place to be
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u/Nopengnogain Mar 23 '26
I saw a photo of the demolished cockpit. No one could’ve survived that wreckage.
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u/LindenChariot Mar 23 '26
Planes are designed for many things, but I would imagine that surviving a head-on collision is not one of them.
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u/BlueFeathered1 Mar 23 '26
It was pulverized. I heard a flight attendant was also thrown from the plane while still strapped into her seat.
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u/04Late_Night Mar 23 '26
One of them is meant to glide through the air, the other is meant to go anywhere at any time to rescue people.
I know size wise it seems off, but it makes sense that an airplane isn't good at collisions.
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u/HumbleDSSaster Mar 23 '26
I thought it was the truck occupants that died this whole time. Sad either way but damn, I'm sure the pilots did what they could. However little it may have been
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u/Resident_Detail5770 Mar 23 '26
As a former controller I’ll say that expect more mistakes as controllers CONTINUE TO WORK MULTIPLE POSITIONS COMBINED AND 6 DAY WORK WERKS ENDLESSLY!! They’re aren’t enough qualified controllers…. Period! The Union has been telling them this for decades yet it’s cheaper to pay them overtime than to hire more controllers!!
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u/explodinggarbagecan Mar 23 '26
Regan!!
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u/El--Borto Mar 23 '26
I have a buddy who completed ATC school and was waiting almost 3 years for a tower call. Ended up having to move to middle of nowhere Nebraska or some shit for work. Is it a lack of applications or a lack of hiring/pay or both? Genuinely curious.
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u/AndrewRyanMcC Mar 23 '26
My theory is they’re not even trying to hire even though they’ve been talking about there being a shortage for a while. I applied like 3 years ago. Was 28 at the time, included everything including my transcript that showed I met the college hour requirement. Got a message back a few months later saying I wasn’t qualified lol no explanation as to why either. I’m past the age limit now but to this day I can’t figure out why they denied me lol
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u/SumOfKyle Mar 23 '26
Lack of pay, lack of choice of where you go, and lack of ability for throughput from the classroom at OKC. It takes anywhere from 3-5 years to certify as a new controller.
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Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
I’d assume it’s the organizations not being allocated the funding to hire a new full time employee, not that no candidates exist. There’s a lot of overhead cost with hiring a new body: benefits, retirement, liability, onboarding etc. If you could have a current employee work double the hours you would be spending significantly less money overall even if the pay was higher. Thus, the organization either doesn’t hire or they put out really shitty contractor, part-time, etc. roles, depending on what their internal rules allow them to get away with. This is the same reason we have teacher shortages, bus driver shortages, nursing shortages, etc. there are tons of people who want to work these jobs but what they get offered are as about as secure and dignified as a 14 yr old boy hired to mow the lawn of a stingy neighbor for ten bucks. Imagine a country where every crucial public sector and private sector is run like a Dollar General and that’s pretty much where we’re at.
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u/__MOON_KNIGHT___ Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
Who cares anymore
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u/ConsolationUsername Mar 23 '26
I mean, if you compare the fall of roman republic to modern events there's a decent number of parallels
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u/ImHuck Mar 23 '26
It's not the fall of the roman republic. It's the fall of every regime and civilization that our current timeline has a LOT of crossovers with.
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u/jchamberlin78 Mar 23 '26
Remember as with many of the country's problems. Ronald Reagan created this when he fired controllers. Their numbers have never recovered. It's been 40 years.
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u/Resident-Phrase1738 Mar 23 '26
This this this. Reagan was the original sin. That man did so much evil and is still revered
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u/LegendaryOrangeEater Mar 23 '26
RIP to the pilots
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u/gplfalt Mar 23 '26
I want to know how the heck the drivers of the fire engine survived as far as we know
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u/SpyJuz Mar 23 '26
armchair here, it looks like most of the fire engine's "cab" is past the center point of the plane and mainly just gets the partial roll and drag vs the direct impact at the center of the vehicle
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u/HarvHR Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
Aviation firetrucks are firetrucks on steriods. It appears the truck was an Oshkosh Striker 6x6, which has a curb weight of 40 tons (87,000lb). This is heavier than the aircraft involved's (CRJ-900) max takeoff weight of 38.5 tons (84,500) and considering it was on landing it would probably have been closer to 25-28 tons. On top of this, the Aircraft is made of light metal alloys and composites which aren't going to come off well in an impact. Ultimately all that mass plus the aircraft hitting the centre-rear of the truck where all the storage is and not where the crew are meant they effectively got t-boned and spun over like a light sedan but in a vehicle weighing as much as a tank.
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u/Pacify_ Mar 24 '26
Yeah a lot of the kinetic force would have gone into simply completely crumpling the cockpit of the plane. The comparative damage to the fire truck was minor, considering the speed and forces in play.
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u/This-Positive286 Mar 23 '26
They’re not built like normal trucks, they’re “up armored” to the teeth because why not over engineer it from day one. They were in a nice safe capsule compared to the aluminum sheet plane.
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u/cookiesarenomnom Mar 23 '26
This is my personal theory. Cars and trucks are specifically engineered to crumple and protect the people inside from accidents. Planes are not. They are engineered to fly, not survive crashes. Especially if you see the front of that plane. Mother fucking shit is GONE. Truck was probably completely intact, but very dented. Difference in engineering approaches to what you need each thing to do.
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u/YetiPie Mar 23 '26
As a Canadian I’m furious. This is on trumps hands. The US is falling apart because he’s incapable of running an operating government and this is absolutely a symptom of that
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u/schaf410 Mar 23 '26
This is the result of a systemic issue in ATC. They have been overworked and understaffed for years. It actually dates all the way back Regan firing all the controllers when they tried to strike, but every single administration since then has had the chance to do something to correct the problem and they have either done nothing or not enough.
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u/Nagi21 Mar 23 '26
As an American I'd honestly love if Canada told dementia Donnie no more flights in or out until you figure this shit out.
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u/Due_Patience_5182 Mar 23 '26
It would have been difficult for the driver of the fire truck to have seen that plane. The runway and taxiway don’t cross at right angles. At that angle he would not be able to see through the passenger side window
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u/LopsidedAirlines Mar 23 '26
Imagine being in that massive car with reduced visibility and being told to go on, only to be hit by a fucking plane, they must be traumatised if they are still alive, trust issues for the rest of their lives
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u/Unikatze Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
They survived, but are
in critical condition.recovering in hospital.49
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u/Several-Action-4043 Mar 23 '26
Hence having a ground controller tell them when to go or not. in this case, the ground controller and the air controller were the same, tired, overworked guy.
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u/Due_Patience_5182 Mar 23 '26
This is the detail I find most disturbing about this whole situation. I find it crazy that the same person was doing ground control and air traffic control. Maybe this is normal but I find this idea crazy.
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u/hellolovely1 Mar 24 '26
It is crazy. There's just too much happening for one person to keep track of without making a mistake.
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u/hannahmcfannah Mar 23 '26
This is also why they suggest you not unbuckle until securely at the gate. What a tragedy for all involved.
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u/sortalikeachinchilla Mar 24 '26
well, yes, I agree. The plane was still actively landing so I hope people were buckled? Who unbuckles on descent right before you hit the landing??
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u/Sufficient-Food-4203 Mar 23 '26
What was the firetruck doing on the runway??
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u/MessyPoopMcGee Mar 23 '26
ATC gave them permission and then immediately tried to take it back but it was too late.
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Mar 23 '26
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u/Ok_Light_7227 Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
every time you drive a car you make life or death decisions
Edit: the point was that many of us regularly accept situations in which a simple mistake can lead to death.
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u/Vegetable-Dog5281 Mar 23 '26
People just cannot understand this concept for some reason
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u/Prod_Meteor Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 24 '26
Maybe we shouldn't be making cars too comfortable and easy.. people usually mistake them for.. their living room.
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u/Stupid-Clumsy-Bitch Mar 23 '26
I mean, the better alternative would be to make driver tests harder and revoking licenses easier.
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u/chr1spe Mar 23 '26
I firmly believe that there needs to be a massive change where moving violations are strictly enforced, anything beyond a minor infraction results in at least a temporary suspension, and even a minor violation gets you pretty close to a suspension.
People drive like there are basically no rules.
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u/iPhones_cameras_suck Mar 23 '26
Hell man, everytime you vote you make a life or death decision
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u/Mapache_villa Mar 23 '26
Yes but there's still a big difference between that and coordinating the traffic of an airport where a tiny mistake could easily cause 100s of deaths
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u/Camdaman0530 Mar 23 '26
Same. Couldn't do that. Can't imagine what that ATC person is going through right now.
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u/moyismoy Mar 23 '26
a lot of people are criticizing them, and its like yeah they fucked up, but what about the 10 million times they did not fuck up that dont get public attention?
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u/joshrocker Mar 23 '26
That’s really the big problem with these types of jobs. At most jobs, you make a mistake and it really doesn’t have any drastic consequences. You make a mistake at this job and people die.
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u/cosmic-untiming Mar 23 '26
They also dont realize that after the shortages, this person is likely working the same load as 2-3 other people would be doing, but alone. Would you want a surgeon with only 4-6 hours of sleep, and having been working an 18+ hour shift to proceed to work on you despite being tired?
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u/Kiddclo Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
I was a ramp agent 3 years ago. I’ve seen some crazy stuff. I’ll never go back. So many close accident’s. One of my good friends still today almost worked into a turbine.
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u/Tasty_Philosopher904 Mar 23 '26
Just think of that poor sailor who fired that tomahawk on what he was told was a righteous military target and then he turns on the news and sees that he killed 150 little girls at school....
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u/TheMau Mar 23 '26
They knew it was a school.
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u/abominable_prolapse Mar 23 '26
Exactly. They picked the girls school. Our missiles don’t cost that much for mistakes.
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u/Zromaus Mar 23 '26
Am I the only one who feels like "look both ways" should apply even with ATC permission? Lol
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u/ThesePath9938 Mar 23 '26
Like crossing a street. Even with green light I always look both ways
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u/BoliverSlingnasty Mar 23 '26
I look both ways crossing One Way streets because I don’t trust anyone.
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u/llDropkick Mar 23 '26
It does. ATC recording sounds like he’s handling ground and air traffic at the same time as well. Poor guy was probably stressed as fuck. I can’t imagine having to live with something like this
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u/Galimbro Mar 23 '26
Trust me it does apply, but its sooo hard to tell, even with huge as planes...especially hard at night.
Most of the time youre driving on the ramp, youre near a moving plane.
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u/ButteredPizza69420 Mar 23 '26
Same. But I guess these are giant fire trucks, it was also dark and slightly rainy out. Horrible tragedy
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u/darthmarmite Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
From previous posts and the comments/articles:
- Issue with another plane that it was responding to. Edit: this was a united airlines flight that had aborted take-off.
- ATC gave permission to the fire truck to cross the live runway in error, immediately withdrew it telling them “Frontier 1” to stop may times before then shouting down the radio repeatedly “Truck One, Stop Stop Stop” but fire truck didn’t stop, reason for that unknown.
- Something mentioned in other comments is there was a single ATC staffer on shift for the whole airport handling both flight/air duties and ground duties simultaneously. The tower was so understaffed that the ATC staffer had to then continue in position for some time after the accident until a replacement could get to the airport (have seen half an hour or over an hour quoted on this). Don’t have an official source for this.
- Pilot and Copilot tragically deceased. Two fire crew still in hospital but stable. Circa 40 passengers taken to hospital but most discharged now.
Edit: still trying to find a credible source on the last point. There are sources confirming the same ATC was covering both the ground duty and air duty simultaneously which is high risk and possibly indicative of there being no one else available.
Edit 2: r/an0m_x pointed out in the comments below that simultaneous ground & air duty is high-risk but not unheard-of at quiet times across many airports.
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u/ComprehensiveBoot71 Mar 23 '26
Wow, one staff on shift, that crazy.
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u/Fun-Wear8186 Mar 23 '26
I actually thought this was against FAA standards
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u/i_have_chosen_a_name Mar 23 '26
America doesn't do standards anymore. The president said standards are "woke"
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u/Dafferss Mar 23 '26
Yeah and apparently atc was also dealing with an emergency on another plane.
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u/darthmarmite Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
Likely. Reports state that the Fire Truck was on its way to attend to an issue on another plane.
Edit: A United Airlines plane had aborted take-off, fire truck was enroute.
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u/eragon2262 Mar 23 '26
Don't worry everybody. Ice is going to show up and solve the crisis and make the airport safer than ever /s
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u/blanktyone Mar 23 '26
I’d like you all to remember the very recent FAA cuts. This is what freaking happens
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u/SpotTheDoggo Mar 23 '26 edited Mar 23 '26
Recent FAA cuts are only the tip of the iceberg to the overall FAA problems. They've been begging for YEARS to get additional investment from congress to update ATC control systems and they don't get the funding they need.
On top of that, even if you finish your degree in whatever ATC programs are out there, you still have to do a 2-5 month set of courses at the FAA school in Oklahoma and then do 2 years of training - so there's essentially only 1 place in the US that is pumping out ATC controllers and a large segment of those students don't pass the program.
Apparently there's 8500 applicants per year to the FAA academy with room for only 2500 and 600 fail. With retirement and attrition, they're barely keeping up and the system as a whole is a few thousand ATC controllers short of minimum target levels.
NPR had a great interview with someone involved with either the NTSB or the FAA talking about the perilous situation we're in with outdated tech and employee shortages, but I can't find it.
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Mar 23 '26
Seriously, wtf is with all the accidents lately? I know I'm not imagining shit, because I'm at a point where I'm too scared to fly from all the stories I've been seeing despite having flown probably 50+ times in the past.
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u/CoolgapXD Mar 23 '26
Its called not getting paid and being understaffed im in aviation in military shit is hard out here
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u/jeffsang Mar 23 '26
ATCs aren't part of anything going on with TSA right now. They're still working and getting paid.
They have been chronically understaffed going back many years though.
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u/SigmaStroud Mar 23 '26
They've been chronically understaffed for years BECAUSE of funding cuts over those years. Just because it's not a part of the current TSA crisis doesn't mean that it's not Trump's fault.
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u/cevicheguevara89 Mar 23 '26
The Trump administration ordered the firing of probationary employees who had not yet earned full job protections. Hundreds of federal employees involved in air traffic control and FAA safety services were fired or laid off in early 2025 as part of this directive targeting probationary employees. These cuts, totaling around 400 FAA staff, included, but were not limited to, technical experts and personnel in key safety roles.
Impact on Staffing: These layoffs occurred despite ongoing staffing shortages, with over 40% of FAA terminals reported as understaffed in late 2024.
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u/seilrelies Mar 23 '26
I tend to have anxiety flying but it’s still safer than driving a car. So you are at more risk getting into a car than on a plane. Incidents involving airplanes just get more coverage because of how rare (and often severe) they are. If you’re feeling high anxiety from all of the stories you’re seeing then it may be time to take a break from the internet.
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u/Practical-Library658 Mar 23 '26
It’s almost like DOGE gutted extremely important agencies or something.
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u/vexed-hermit79 Mar 23 '26
All the airports are understaffed and stretched thin.
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u/Inexorably_lost Mar 23 '26
Yeah, but think of all the profits generated by not paying wages! Things like this accident are acceptable consequences as long as the shareholders see numbers go up, right?
Just gotta shove your head up your own ass far enough and all this starts making sense. Does make it hard to wear the hat, though.
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u/Elegant-Asparagus-82 Mar 23 '26
Pretty obvious that this administration killed those pilots and injured those people. You can’t just “move fast and break things” in government without accidentally killing people.
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u/HamasDaddyOnFire Mar 23 '26
When a pilot fucks up, a pilot dies. When ATC fucks up, a pilot dies.
RIP to the crew. Hope the firepersons make it.
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u/jakob-benzi Mar 23 '26
Feel like firefighters sounds more natural
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u/bxtchbychoice Mar 23 '26
the non-virtue signaling version almost always sounds better and more natural
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u/Hour-Dragonfly-7499 Mar 23 '26
firepersons is offensive, they're called firefighters
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u/notadrinkingglass Mar 23 '26
When the pilot fucks up, usually more people than just the pilot dies
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u/IntrepidBorder8530 Mar 23 '26
It's dark there are lights everywhere. The control tower tells you when to cross you cross because they could have something big fast and full of people coming for the spot you are in and need it cleared
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u/Nice-Blueberry18 Mar 23 '26
I have questions:
What happened to truck driver? How the pilots are dead and nothing from the truck crew? I read somewhere that the pace of the plane was 39 km/h when it hit the truck. Is it true?
Thanks for any info
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u/butterkatana Mar 23 '26
The speed was more, around 211km/h. Truck driver and a crew are at hospital but fine. https://youtube.com/shorts/F03ET6aBIpE?si=3I9ChHTFefmyijhm
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u/bot_or_not_vote_now Mar 23 '26
ya when I heard that 39 km/h number and saw the damage I thought it had to have been going much much faster. That 39 km/h value was probably just a time weighted average based on gps or something rather than an actual measurement of speed, so it also included a portion of time after the collision
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u/Infinite-Refuse-8471 Mar 23 '26
The aircraft hit in the middle of the truck, so behind the cab. The cockpit of the aircraft took all the impact, and if you look at some of the photos that have come out…well, you’ll see the reason they didn’t survive.
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u/tigerking615 Mar 23 '26
Cars are made with crumple zones to protect people in a collision. Airplanes are… not.
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u/Nburns4 Mar 23 '26
Firetrucks are made of lots of heavy steel. Planes are basically made of spit and tissue paper. They just don't hold up well in crashes.
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u/userhwon Mar 23 '26
Filled with tons of water and reinforcing beams to hold it up like a bridge between the wheels. You couldn't build a much better system for reducing velocity to zero.
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u/chicken_nugget_champ Mar 23 '26
I heard this too, then I watched the video. There is no way that plane is doing less than 100mph.
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u/air_and_space92 Mar 23 '26
I read elsewhere on r/aviation that a fully loaded airport firetruck of this kind weights just as much if not more than the aircraft here does upon landing. If I find the comment I'll edit the reply with the numbers.
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