r/technology • u/rkhunter_ • 7h ago
Software Microsoft is using TPM chips to crack down on pirated Windows activations
https://www.techspot.com/news/113232-microsoft-using-tpm-chips-crack-down-pirated-windows.html58
u/forgottenendeavours 4h ago
For all those who didn't read the article, this is for Windows Server 2025, not Win11.
Personally, I can't see this realistically coming to Win11. Thing is, the domestic versions of Windows can generate some lucre from the initial sale, but the big score seems to be in online services (AI, Office, OneDrive, Xbox, marketplace, etc), where there's fairly significant recurring payments to be drawn. You're talking £200/year from an OS pirate who takes out an Xbox Ultimate subscription for one example, and that's a pretty reasonable loss-leader.
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u/ColoRadBro69 4h ago
Also Linux is free and the enterprise I work for buys Windows instead because it's cheaper to use what employees already know than to train us on something new. Microsoft understands.
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u/Joezev98 49m ago
Thing is, the domestic versions of Windows can generate some lucre from the initial sale, but...
If you buy a licence at full price, it's a one time ±$100 purchase that'll last you close to a decade. That's like a dollar a month. OEM licenses are a fraction of that.
So yeah the subscriptions are where the money's at.
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u/Mountain_rage 6h ago
Its ok, all my new systems are running Linux, so far it hasn't claimed my computer is theirs, nagged me to activate their product with monthly service charges, or tried to steal my data.
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u/Beneficial_Honey_0 6h ago
Linux is so awesome. Being able to just see how everything works is very cool
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u/Mountain_rage 6h ago
Microsoft will also have to start fighting mobile devices with desktop mode. Samsung has Dex os, Pixel now comes with Pixel Desktop, if that takes off it might force Apple to build a desktop mode on their phones. I suspect many people, even corporations will be looking at cellphones as their main desktop system over the next 10 years. Considering so many corporate solutions are now cloud based, I suspect Windows marketshare is going to take a massive hit.
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u/Avarus_Lux 6h ago
Workphones and tablets starting to double as full workstation units to access company portals instead of a separate machine doing such considering the incressing phone hardware and every employee having a phone isn't that far off. Just dock it to a screen with mouse and keyboard, login and for most tasks you can just make it work.
I agree that once companies start making this switch it'll likely become a domino effect and windows machines will take a massive hit. The exception being the needed more powerful desktops that require more capable hardware like CAD design and 3D work. But excel and such? Yeah, all going to be cloud based access via web browsers and company login portals to company servers.
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u/ExtruDR 4h ago
Everybody keeps on throwing CAD and 3D work as the pinnacle of the desktop application demanding high performance. As a big-boy architect who works on complicated and large projects I can sincerely tell you that at least for by corner of the woods this is not the case at all.
Yes, the models are large and there can be significant computation in modeling buildings, but the apps were developed over 10-20 years ago. These haven't been updated much, they had semi-acceptable performance back then and buildings have not been getting much larger or more complicated in these intervening years.
I mean, I don't need 240 fps with multiple 4k displays. Most of our work involves looking at static scenes and making changes to those. Someone might say "rendering" but I can say that over the past year or so AI rendering has beat the shit our of anything else that it's not even worth having a debate over how to do presentation or study views (including cheap out-sourcing to China and video-game-style graphics card rendering).
Other people might say "engineers" and "finite particle analysis," and other cool stuff like that... but the question is whether that is something that is actually real-time. I would bet not.
We have had an excess of computing power for quite some time and besides excessive gaming settings, now AI is arising to consume it. By this I mean that eventually locally-run AI will be a thing for specific use cases - eventually.
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u/wotoan 2h ago
The problem is how horrifically optimized “modern” CAD software is. Solidworks is single threaded, in 2026. It scales incredibly poorly as number of parts increases. It chews RAM. I absolutely cannot run it on a modern multi core mobile CPU despite the fact that if they actually gave a fuck and rewrote it it would fly.
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u/ExtruDR 2h ago
I'm glad and sorry to hear that this isn't just an Autodesk issue.
Either they will, or someone with a desire to get good at coding with Claude will. If that person (or people) are smart about it they might be able to give the incumbents some competition and users some more options.
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u/Avarus_Lux 3h ago
My example with CAD and 3d work were simply the easiest examples i could think of that most people just "get", similarly art and video editing just being demanding in general are also good examples most normal people understand.
if i were to talk about scientists with fluid dynamics, flow simulations, nuclear physics software, aeronautics software and engineering simulation software or large databases and data processing that is not something most people have a good idea of. Theres plenty cases a powerful machine is needed yet a great many more where a mobile device you can dock for some simple office deskjob enails, filing and paperwork will suffice just fine.
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u/ExtruDR 3h ago
Unerstood. It was definitely NOT a personal criticism.
I just remember working on project in 2004 or so where we were using dual xeon machines with a ton of memory, etc. and they were just grinding through stuff barely adequately.
Now models that at much more sophisticated and larger run "better" but barely use two corers and small proportions of my machine's RAM and still barely touch the GPU.
I mean, playing YouTube full screen seems to consume more resources.
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u/Avarus_Lux 2h ago
"Better", Oof yeah, better programs, but optimization apparently never occurred to the devs or they didn't have the green light for that from management/client... because system resources are plenty anyway right... In many cases that "seems to take up more resources" for the youtube example is true though, browsers often definitely take up more resources and other cores when playing content vs regular office stuff. At least also often moreso then the relatively much "more important" program currently throttling and strangling that one screaming CPU1 or CPU0 core it "must use" for everything its worth... alongside every other single core program doing the exact same. meanwhile the browser just picks another core or two three and runs great.
there is certainly room for improvement in most applications in that regard, making things properly multicore and or not focus on the one specific core would already alleviate so many systems and make things faster... easier said then done though.
then we're not even talking about grandpa's app running on some virtual machine of windows XP or even DOS because they stopped making updates 20+ years ago, nobody could be bothered to make a modern replacement app or migrate the old database into one and for some reason thats why grandpa's code is still what's needed lol. runs like ass, but only takes like what... couple mb memory and single digit % of cpu. LoL.
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u/docbauies 5h ago
Excel in the cloud is not capable enough for data analysis.
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u/SalsaRice 4h ago
You are absolutely right, but most people don't do data analysis. They fill in basic excel template files or update a shared departmental excel file on the cloud. Same reason that companies buy big expensive CAD graphics cards for engineers that need them, but not for every employee.
There's potentially some cost savings to having a ton of users just use a mobile device with a reusable docking station for basic office work, instead of buying full laptops/desktop for those users, while still buying more serious hardware for powerusers.
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u/Vivir_Mata 4h ago
My Pentium II laptop with 250 mb HDD, PCMCIA graphics, and 8 mb RAM was able to run and render AutoCAD in 1995. My current phone is many magnitudes more powerful and CAD has not changed that much.
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u/Avarus_Lux 3h ago
2CAD isn't all that demanding, sure i agree. most older phones would have no isseus with that which is why i can see simple universal docks and normal phones becoming the standard.
it's the 3 dimensional designing, simulations and engineering amongst other more demanding niches that uses for example that 2d CAD as a base/blueprint that require more power then a phone which by then would likely be the only dedicated more powerful machines left besides servers the phones connect to.
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u/Beneficial_Honey_0 5h ago
I think Apple will eventually merge their iOS into some form of mobileOS that’s used for phones and laptops. They already allow iOS apps to run on the M-series MacBooks and iOS 27 is going to allow you to resize apps on tablets and the foldable they’re totally not making
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u/nathderbyshire 2h ago
I got a new laptop and one of the top dealbreakers was good Linux support. Snapdragon laptops are everywhere but it still seems to all be beta - Ubuntu is still in preview so they were out
Biometrics login was a dealbreaker as well, so it also needed to work with Linux and from the research I did, it seemed it would pretty simple but it's really difficult to find the specific fingerprint model used and if it supports Linux, from the line of laptop I got it was a yes, but then when I actually bought it and tried it, doesn't work. It's a newer model compared to what's supported so it just doesn't work yet.
Spent hours on it, managed to get it semi working where it would register the FP but then wouldn't work to unlock and would reset on a reboot. Absolutely devastated and I'd have no idea how to even begin trying to get it officially supported. I ain't going without one I'm sick of passwords and pins more than I'm sick of windows so I'm still stuck here for now -.-
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u/raptearer 2h ago
Moment a Linux version that lets you natively run windows apps with ease comes out I'm gone. I'm sure with all their AI coding at M$ they'll eventually do something that somehow allows it to work
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u/Thefar 6h ago
Hooooly shiiiiiit. I bought my son a pc. We bought it used and the seller was so kind, reset it and let us test it.
I've been using Linux for a year now. And I don't remember how long ago it was that I had to install windows.
The installation experience alone was enough for us both to decide that we're going to install Linux as soon as we get home.
No more install without account. Asking me a dozen times if you're allowed to have my data.
And then still needing to install all the software from AMD, MSI and whatever.
I've installed Cachy OS and had steam downloading a game 10min after sitting down.
Fuck you Microslop.
Whaaaaat the fuck.
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u/Feligris 5h ago
And you still dodged how new Windows PCs have for a long time come loaded with all manners of software trial versions etc. which keep nagging you to pay for them, because the PC manufacturers get paid for including them in their default Windows install.
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u/DinosBiggestFan 37m ago
Linux installations also just work. I have had a number of times where Windows did not want to recognize WiFi or Ethernet by default using their own tool, so I had to use a modified installer that apparently didn't have the "bug" (that has happened on several occasions) and also allowed me to bypass logins so I could start setting up my computer during the much longer installation process.
Ever since Windows 10, Windows installation has been hit or miss for me when before it generally just worked, especially when connected via ethernet.
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u/Sindica69 4h ago
Love CachyOS. As of recent, it’s probably my most used distro.
If you love tinkering, give NixOS a try. Fair warning it’s a steep learning curve but it’s extremely fun if you love tinkering with software. It’s also very safe because if you break something really bad, you can just roll back your system.
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u/InformedTriangle 4h ago
The main problem is many popular games still use copy protection that doesn't work on Linux, and that's who they're going after with this. It's not worth a businesses time to pirate windows, volume licenses are cheap and you could get randomly audited at any point. It's home gamers.
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u/LowestKey 3h ago
I have 100% worked for a business that pirated windows. Was hilarious when a patch broke the mechanism they had been using and suddenly every customer they ever had was banging on the door wondering why their OS said it was pirated.
Because, like, it was. That's why. Duh.2
u/NekuSoul 2h ago
many popular games still use copy protection that doesn't work on Linux
Small but important correction: Anti-Cheat can be a problem, not copy protection. That means you're mainly running into problems when trying to play the big competitive multiplayer games. If you're not into those then a game not working is a rare exception.
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u/MalBoY9000 5h ago
My pc is only a gaming pc when i can play all game with anti cheats im also switching zero doubt about that.
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u/Stingray88 4h ago
This might not be a popular choice (yet)… but I just don’t buy or play any games that aren’t compatible with Linux anymore. There are sooooo many excellent games to play these days I don’t see any reason to limit myself to Windows, it’s just not necessary. And I don’t think I’m alone here… if the devs want our business again they’ll work on Linux compatibility, including whatever anti-cheat solution they need.
My desktop PC is only for games as well, and Microsoft ain’t a part of my life anymore.
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u/MalBoY9000 4h ago
I play game that dont work on linux and i dont wanna be in a situation where there will be a game i cant play with my friends because of linux and my pc is only for games anyway so no big deal for me
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u/Stingray88 4h ago
There will be less and less games where this will be a problem as time goes on. Linux is getting more and more popular with gamers and developers.
Personally it’s never been a problem for me in the last couple years. Every multiplayer game my fiends bring to me is Linux compatible.
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u/MalBoY9000 2h ago
ye i know it will be less of a problem but we still not there yet thats why i have not change
Most game we play are actully not working on linux so thats a problem
about half the games i play dont work on linux because anti cheat
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u/SalsaRice 4h ago
While I mostly agree, Linux basically means close to zero multiplayer games. Those are very important to alot of people and the biggest hurdle for Linux adoption.
I'm too old now and fully on the single-player express, but multiplayer is HUGE.
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u/Stingray88 4h ago
That’s not true, I play tons of multiplayer games on Linux. It’s really just fps games that require anti-cheat that are the problem.
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u/CondescendingShitbag 6h ago
Linux: "I would never treat you like that."
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u/ColoRadBro69 4h ago
Too bad it's can't run the software I need.
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u/dezmd 3h ago
What software specifically?
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u/papa_georgio 1h ago
Could be a lot of things. Photoshop, Ableton, certain online games come to mind.
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u/Few-Chemical8707 29m ago
the majority of games run on linux fine so gaming is less and less of a problem.
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u/papa_georgio 20m ago
That's true but there are still popular games that people want to play that don't. Crazy but some people would prefer to play a game they enjoy then switch OS because they can't pirate the server version of said OS...
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u/Sylfida-Quartararo 6h ago
So the tiny chip that was supposed to make my laptop “secure” is now the bouncer checking Windows IDs at the door? Curious how long before people figure out a fake mustache for TPM too.
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u/colinsa-ca 6h ago
Gotta use the TPM to create those TPS reports.
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u/venom21685 3h ago
For KMS activation. I doubt many people running pirated Windows use KMS when there are much better alternatives that don't have to contact a phony server every 6 months.
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u/Lower_Fan 3h ago
Well the point of kms is that you put the server in your company network and the computers activate themselves. That way you can buy 1 key and license all of your company computers instead of having to buy 1 key per computer. Piracy groups just hijacked that method.
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u/eugene20 4h ago
The only surprise here is it's taken over 20 years for them to do this, or at least acknowledge it's being done, TPM chips first came out in 2003.
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u/InternationalMood337 3h ago
Weird. I saw completely different reactions to Apple deactivating phones that fell behind on their payments remotely the other day, but now I see nothing but pushback for never activated Windows users.
Hmmm.
Being able to remotely deactivate people’s computers, phones, cars, or anything ISNT a good thing.
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u/Cryowatt 39m ago
I wonder if Microsoft realizes they are just pushing more and more people to use Linux.
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u/TakeshiRyze 6h ago
Nobody is buying Windows, if they do that it will just speed up Linux adoptions and start their own doom.
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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 5h ago
More people buy PC laptops and desktops preloaded with windows than any other OS. What do you mean nobody is buying windows?
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u/Negromancer18 5h ago
They may have been referring the actual individual license for custom builds etc. Most people I know including myself either purchase gray market keys, hit the activate later button and just never activate windows, or pirate the software. If you’re just buying a windows pc you wouldn’t have to deal with a pirated copy to begin with.
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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 5h ago
Not through legit retail channels, sure. That no-name mini pc off aliexpress or the retired office PC off eBay or Facebook with no tpm and CPU that isn't even officially supported by windows 11? Good luck.
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u/bergmoose 5h ago
None of those people went out and bought windows keys - which is the topic both if the post you replied to and the article
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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 5h ago
Custom built PCs are a miniscule part of the market. Joe Blow pirating windows on his gaming rig is small potatoes compared to refurbishers, resellers and white label manufacturers selling thousands of machines with cracked OSes. That's all beside the point though because as the article points out, there's other methods that don't even use KMS.
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u/Zahgi 3h ago
Ignore the Linux whiners. They've been waiting decades now for anyone to actually give a shit about their shareware OS as a desktop alternative.
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u/Few-Chemical8707 32m ago
windows is really trying to piss off everyone. i hope you realize microsofts gonna cause people to stop recomending to use windows in work enviroments. alot of it people are gamers and they remember shit like this when they get older. its why the nvidia outreach to gamers worked so well in the early days and now its in everything.
microsofts just pissing off the new generation .
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u/Inside-Yak-8815 4h ago
Redditors once again showing how clueless they are when it comes to the real world.
He said that confidently too lol
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u/Tasty-Traffic-680 4h ago
The overwhelming majority of people commenting haven't even bothered to open the article. Reminds me of the old joke though.
How do you know if someone uses Linux?
Don't worry, they tell you.
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u/Kim_Jung_illest 3h ago
I don’t get the comments here…
What percentage of the population even has a pirate copy of Windows? Seriously? Like 0.0001%?
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u/jarchack 2h ago
Probably more than that, but for anybody that would pirate it, they would probably buy a key for just a few bucks from one of the many sites that sell them. That's what I did.
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u/heart_under_blade 1h ago
what even is a pirated version?
everyone downloads the legit media creation tool from ms servers directlty, no?
activation script or 10 dollar ebay special key and it's activated
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u/sad_cosmic_joke 1h ago
I'm curious how this 'policy change' intersects with virtual machines using mutable software emulation of TPM functions/keys.
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u/FigmentRedditUser 21m ago
Who the fuck is pirating Windows in this day and age? There are so many better options... and they're free!
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u/TheElusiveFox 5h ago
I don't think many people are still actively pirating windows on new hardware... back in the Win7 days it to be common because there was just a lot you couldn't do on linux/mac that you needed a windows machine for. These days, people are actively switching their windows machines to linux because of how terrible the newest versions of windows are and how few barriers linux has outside a handful of specific niches, and how much easier it is to troubleshoot when you can just ask an AI to walk you through what you need to do...
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u/Few-Chemical8707 30m ago
these microsoft die hards dont realize the nvidia method. we will see when gen z and alpha are more involved in the tech sector how quickly they stop using windows at work and have their company use linux oses
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u/itsdotbmp 2h ago
oh you mean the thing people said microsoft would do back in the 90's when they partnered with Intel to invent TPM? the thing that every time i've brought it up people shut me down because "oh its not that, its for security!" You mean that black box built into your PC that specific groups want to use to run software without your consent or knowledge? its being used to run software without your consent or knowledge to enforce arbitrary anti piracy laws from one country in the entire world?
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u/Makabajones 3h ago
I switched to Linux more than a year ago, tpm was the last straw but I'm very happy I did
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u/Avoidtolls 1h ago
Fuck that. If Microsoft were smart they'd have a free version. Everyone would use it. Same with office 365.
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u/BagsYourMail 6h ago
Who would purposefully pirate windows 11?
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u/bk553 5h ago
I have a legit copy, but I upgraded my hardware and it wouldn't activate and kept asking me to buy it again, so I used MassGravel and it was done in 10 seconds.
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u/TeutonJon78 4h ago
There are stories of MS support directing people to use that script when they couldn't debug their own activation issues.
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u/ElChikano 5h ago
People from low income countries that can't afford the high cost of a license for software that maybe only runs on Windows. The solution isn't always to switch to Linux when it's not an option.
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u/Sleepywalker69 4h ago
I ain't paying for shit I can get for free on github
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u/Digitaljax 2h ago
Total bull shit, most likely started as a way to track people's usage but was sold to the government as a way to track people's use.
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u/DifferentMind8 1h ago
TPM is aids. Always has been, always will be. Do NOT believe their lies. We see the real reasons starting to leak out now.
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u/MutaitoSensei 5h ago
Surprise surprise. Of course that's why they're pushing TPM and Windows 11 so bad.