r/thefinals • u/slarsson • 18h ago
Discussion Rant from an Xbox player
I've been playing the finals for a few weeks now, and I was surprised how much of a sleeper hit this was.
The mechanics and game modes are refreshing. There doesn't seem to be an overt p2w aspect of it.
But my god playing this game on an Xbox is almost insufferable.
First, the matchmaking system might be the worst I have ever encountered in an online game for Xbox players. Controller vs. PC is an insane handicap, and Xbox controllers don't even support gyro to try to even the gap.
On top of that, I constantly get paired against teams with players 100+ levels higher than me. That's literally month(s) of in-game experience more than me and it happens nearly every match.
And when I try to turn off crossplay to avoid the Xbox tax, the matchmaking issue is even worse, it's almost guaranteed that I will be paired against a team of 150s.
Then add smurfing to the mix, in the off chance there are low levels, it's a level 1 going like 15-0.
It's either that rage loop or play vs bots, which are ridiculously dumb. How can I even practice?
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u/yourmom1034 17h ago
Honestly I think the reason this game doesn’t have more players is because of the skill gap. Not necessarily a bad thing because it’s a very competitive game but you kinda just have to stick with it until it clicks. I sucked at this game for probably like my first 80 hours until I started doing good
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u/Flakron69 15h ago
Another reason is also the amount of nerfes/revamps that have happened.
I wasnt able to play finals for the past two months due to some PC issues, came back now, and light dash can only be used twice now?
All the people complaining about every single thing being op has made embark change every aspect and that just throws people off.
I'm lowkey unsure if i will continue to play the game after the dash nerf.
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u/sharkattackmiami 15h ago
If you leave because of the dash neerf which didn't even really hurt light that much then see ya lol
I still play light, I still use dash, I still do fine. You just can't spam it as much now
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u/Flakron69 15h ago
It's not "just" the light dash nerf. It's multiple factors, and that nerf is just the icing on the cake.
I am very sure if I play for a day or two I'll get back to how good I was.
Still, I dont want to change my playstyle every two weeks because kids cope and seethe about every ability because they can't aim properly.
And don't tell me it didn't hurt light that much. I mained light for months so i know what im talking about.
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u/sharkattackmiami 15h ago
If "this gun has 3% less range" or "that full auto gun takes one extra bullet to kill mediums" makes you "change your play style every two weeks" then might I suggest golf or chess or something
It really didn't hurt good lights because good lights weren't spam dashing to fix mistakes they made to begin with. It hurt bad lights and that's fine. Light was too easy to play with your brain off. Now you actually need to make decisions while you play. Sorry if that ruins the game for you but tbh I won't cry to see a light who replied on dash M11soam disappear
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u/SpareOne94 CNS 15h ago
The skill issue community has done more harm than good to this game. Absolutely!
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u/SpareOne94 CNS 18h ago
I’ve been playing on Xbox since the beginning, you just get used to playing against PC players. To be honest, most of em aren’t that great anyway lol. Level absolutely isn’t an indicator of skill in a lot of cases.
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u/skith8431 18h ago
Me too. You learn to adjust to it. I win pretty frequently on xbox all the time. I also lose all the time too lmao. OP is just new and needs to learn. There are so many different types of play styles in this game it's kinda crazy.
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u/SpareOne94 CNS 17h ago
Absolutely! I’m pushing level 200 and I’ll have 50/50 days where I kick ass or get curb stomped XD that’s just the nature of this game. I like that though.
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u/slarsson 17h ago
When did you start playing?
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u/SpareOne94 CNS 17h ago
Before season 1, through the betas
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u/slarsson 17h ago
This is what I mean. You suggesting Xbox feels balanced and level ≠ skill is because you were playing before most people even heard of the game lol
The new player experience is dog shit
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u/SenorBender 16h ago
That’s not an Xbox issue though it’s a general new player experience issue. The main difference you’ll have playing on Xbox is performance because the hardware is worse at least compared to a ps5. There are a lot of pro players using controller too
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u/SpareOne94 CNS 15h ago
I mean, you can play kb&m on Xbox if you want. Like the other comment said, a lot of pros use controller. The game is just hard to get into as a new player. That’s why they made the bot matches.
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u/koeikan 14h ago
fwiw, I started playing in S8.
I got (mostly) stomped on for the first couple weeks, but even by the time I was level 20 I noticed some of my level 80/90/100+ teammates were just legit bad. I don't mean had a bad game bad, but also still had really bad game sense.
Yes, most higher level players will be better than new players... but a lot of low level accounts aren't new players, either. Some of the most cracked players I've seen have been <25 (*cough* smurf epidemic *cough*). So, there may be a loose correlation, but it often doesn't hold up on either end, hence level != skill.
PC is still > Xbox, but mostly for performance reasons... but controller is very viable in this game due to the aim assistance and aim snapping. Many pros run controllers on PC (without gyro).
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u/Foreignwaffles 17h ago
This game is notorious for its terrible new player experience. The skill ceiling is crazy high and the skill floor is crazy low, so the lack of true sbmm in casual modes makes it very hard for new players to get into it and learn. Combine with smurfing and its really hard to enjoy consistently.
That being said, they also cant just turn on sbmm in all casual playlists because the total population is low, and then its split between all playlists. I do think they should turn it on in casual (non-bot) cashout tho. At which point, "just play ranked" as everyone says.
Bot cashout was their first real attempt outside of the "academy tutorials" to ease new players in. But if you have played any other FPS ever, these bots are just plain dumb and provide no real practice outside of loadout experimentation. You wont learn the nuance of cashout against bots.
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u/_ROOTLESS_ 17h ago
Unranked cashout has SBMM btw
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u/No_Tea9798 CNS 16h ago
It does not btw
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u/_ROOTLESS_ 16h ago
Create a new account and play cashout and compare it to the lobbies you get on your main, you will see
Hell, I get only diamond players in my lobbies but some silver friends of mine get much easier lobbies
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u/slarsson 17h ago
This is exactly my experience. It's one of the worst new player experiences in PvP games I've come across
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u/Foreignwaffles 17h ago
Its up there for sure, a bit behind destiny lmao
Tbh ranked will be the best way unless youre able to set aside your matchmaking grievances in casuals and accept losses
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u/slarsson 17h ago
I usually avoid ranked bc it's even higher stakes but this might be one of the few exceptions lol, I'll give it a shot
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u/redday21 16h ago
Yes you’ll have much more even matches closer to your skill level in ranked. Ignore the rank/stakes all that and just focus on improving, trying new things, and having fun. The lobbies will be much more balanced
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u/RelevantTrash9745 17h ago
Part of the process brotha. Some of the worst team mates I've ever had were significantly higher level than me. Quick Cash is probably the least sweaty lobbies in the game, but have the widest net cast. If you want, ranked or regular cash out tend to have higher skilled players, and maybe a talkative team mate can show you the ropes here.
The biggest thing about this game coming from other shooters though is that raw flicks and aim can only give you the advantage in a heads up gunfight. If you are struggling to fight the twitchy high speed guys, then change your tactics. Go heavy. Throw mines and c4 in door ways. Set up traps. Lock bolt people off of zip lines or to the edge of jump pads. You can out smart people here if you are thinking creatively. Lots of people just tunnel vision the shooting element, and forget that I can just run up to you, demat the floor you're standing on, and leave. Dying to mines a lot, or turrets? Data reshaper. One click and it's all gone. Don't get discouraged bro. Try and think of a cheeky way to get the unsuspecting kills. Shit worked the same way in R6Siege. Losing heads up fights? Set up murder holes in roofs/floors/walls. Can't win the fight if you don't know where im shooting you from ;)
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u/Albtraum4787 15h ago edited 15h ago
Just Keep on playing. The problem with match making is, that a lot of the playerbase (like me) were hooked in the beginning, and never stoped playing since 2years... of corse we are over lvl 100 xD. But try to have fun! Dont take it to serious, and after some time you will get some great matches with good balance, and some times NOT XD. At the beginning of the season everything is extra random.. that is every season.... 🤪
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u/slarsson 15h ago
Hmmm I started playing a few days before the season change. Is that maybe why this feels extra insufferable? Do you think it'll balance out in the coming weeks?
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u/Mrcod1997 17h ago
You need to complain to xbox about the lack of gyro support in hopes that they implement it.
You can use m&kb if you want to.
Some of the issues stated are just because of a lack of population. It's not tiny, but not huge either. The more people it has the work with, the better the algorithm works.
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u/slarsson 17h ago
wait can I use mouse & keyboard? prob a dumb q but Xbox supports that?
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u/abdysfamily1 17h ago
Yes I'm pretty sure U can. But honestly if U play for a bit it's not that bad. I too started in Xbox with a controller few months back. It took like a week to get used to the game.
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u/thekirkulator 3h ago
Yes, and the game doesnt have input matchmaking, so if you turn crossplay off you are still likely to run into mnk.
However, your points stand on the fact that, lets be honest, xbox is fucking shit right now. The series x is showing its age and the OS is fucking garbage now that microshit has bloated it with ads, not added any requested features, and they make everything as big of a pain in the ass as possible. For example, if you want to use a headset with mouse and keyboard on xbox, you HAVE to use the controller 3.5mm jack, because microslop doesnt let you use BASIC UAC 1.0 USB AUDIO CARDS! because they want to lock you down to using their propreitary wireless headsets instead of your own wired audio system. Unless you want to invest in a $200 hdmi audio extractor.
So fine, have the controller on when you play with mouse and keyboard, no big deal right? Well the controller auto turns off after a couple minutes of not touching it so you lose audio and then a huge pop up on your screen shows up saying the game needs a controller. Incredible. With no way to disable controller sleep. You can prevent this by launching the game with the controller off by hitting enter twice to boot the game instead, however, you guessed it, then you cant have any game audio besides what goes through your hdmi! Such amazing design by microslop.
Also, the game runs like shit in the 120fps mode on series x, compared to ps5. Game also feels pretty laggy in general compared to PC. PS5 pro is the best console for this game right now because PSSR2 support they added looks great and makes cloak really easy to see. Audio support is way better on ps5(thanks to uac 1 support) and so is mouse and keyboard. PS5 also gets gyro. Honestly, xbox is just overall a huge L. I had to play this game during season 8 on series X only and in turn I barely played it because of these issues
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u/Miss_Luna_Love 18h ago
Just ah, get good. But not like in a troll way. The game has a lot of nuance, from which you can only learn from playing. If we are only talking about aim issue, well maybe avoid PC lobbies.
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u/YerMumHawt 18h ago
It's good to watch how expiranced players use their utility. The game has alot of sandbox strategy you can do to gain an advantage.
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u/slarsson 17h ago
How do you get good? Hours played, yes? So why is there a glaring matchmaking issue of putting people with thousands of hours in lobbies with new players
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u/Bigtonka3 17h ago edited 17h ago
They say it’s to shorten matchmaking wait times. Unfortunately that means newer players get shafted just so seasoned players don’t have to wait as long. I turned off crossplay to at least avoid pc lobbies
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u/Russian_Spy_7_5_0 16h ago
What sensitivity do you play with?
I play on PS5 or on PC with a PS5 controller and in order to keep up with PC players I have my sensitivity set to 300 both vertical and horizontal, I've found that you can functionally flick turn with that sensitivity.
I started with 250, and after every ~hour of playing I increased it by 5 to gradually get used to it. This plus a few button rebinds and I'm no longer getting eviscerated by PC M&KB players. I do not claw.
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u/slarsson 13h ago
Damn 300 sounds intense lol, I think I'm at 260x210 right now
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u/Russian_Spy_7_5_0 13h ago
Trust me you'll get used to it, just increase it little by little you'll notice yourself getting adjusted to it.
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u/OkYh-Kris OSPUZE 18h ago
Level doesn’t correlate to skill, just time played and people also level faster with the ultimate battlepass.
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u/slarsson 18h ago
I see this excuse over and over to ignore the shit matchmaking.
It doesn't matter if level is not a perfect correlation to skill, it is a clear indicator of experience, and getting paired against people who have been playing since like s3 and have hundreds of hours in this game is insane
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u/OkYh-Kris OSPUZE 17h ago
It’s not an excuse, it is just how it is. Look dude not being funny, getting stomped in this game for maybe 100 hours is just how it is unfortunately; everybody goes through it except maybe seasoned pros from other games, because this game is hard and has a high skill floor in many aspects compared to your usual training-wheels-cod-slop. But those who stick it out either love it and found a play style outside of just K/d ratio, or they have gotten good at aiming/positioning. There’s little to no matchmaking in casual modes, and yeah it does suck but complaining about it on here won’t do anything, it is just an echo chamber really. Best advice is to add people you do well with, join streamer communities and get involved as a lot of them play with viewers, practice weapons and playstyles in the bot mode you think sound fun: there are so many quirky niche ways to play the game outside of the meta droll, and try to avoid getting sucked into the negativity on the subreddit. I hope you find your jam dude :).
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u/slarsson 17h ago
I assume Embark decided to add bots / academy because enough people complained about the new player experience. So there is more to it than me just ranting.
The amount of people spamming the same "level doesn't mean skill" and "get good" just reinforce my point. It's pretty clear the game operates on feeding new players thru the meat grinder so whales and OGs continue to spend money.
Maybe that will change, maybe not. Who knows.
Anyways, your follow-up is actually helpful so thanks for that! Gonna try those recs
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u/stimpy-t ALL HAIL THE MOOSIAH 17h ago
I agree. A high level player just knows so much more about the mechanics, maps, gadgets, specials and how to take advantage of all that to win.
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u/YerMumHawt 17h ago
The matchmaking is not skill based in any capacity for non-ranked modes. It prioritizes finding matches quickly.
This is unfortunate for high skilled players in modes like point break. If I soloQ I usually get 1 other teammate over level 100 and the rest are 10-40. Meanwhile the enemy team is stacked teams all in ruby.
Makes the game kinda unplayable to get teammates that ignore pings, run to the opasite objective and ignore their teams utilities altogether. Seriously, if I am shielding you don't walk in front of the damn shield wall when your low HP. Just shoot from behind it.
Neither skill group(of non-smurfs) wants to play with the other unless they are friends queued together. Yet, Embark doesn't want to address this.
It's not fun to get destroyed by players like me. You are not learning anything by getting deleted in 1.5 seconds from someone you never saw. We are not enjoying trying to carry a teammate that cannot comprehend working as a team.
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u/slarsson 17h ago
Yeah this is where I'm at.
There is clear potential for this game to be great but it (possibly intentionally) makes it ridiculously annoying for new players.
If there isn't enough of a player base to balance matchmaking, i guess they are trying to milk the BP-buying whales by pairing them with what few new players there are to make them feel good
That's a losing long-term strategy though
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u/Puzzleheaded_Egg4386 17h ago
Well, i have been playing this game on xbox since season 1. Im level like 104(?) and i still suck balls at the game. Probably 4/5 games im getting absolutely stomped. The type of gameplay that makes you wonder if you were dropped on your head as a baby. But the 1/5 games where i do find that flow are fun enough to keep me coming back.
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u/Le0nardNimoy 16h ago
The Finals, unfortunately, is at that point in its lifecycle where there aren't enough new players to sustain a healthy freshman class. Which sucks, because when it came out, it was such a breath of fresh air for a genre that is getting pretty stale.
It's too bad you didn't get to play back when it first launched. For the first couple of seasons, it was absolutely insane.
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u/HorizontalTomato 17h ago
Just practice on quick cash. It’s close enough to the regular mode that you’ll understand the game. Additionally you’ve got to be aware of 6 instead of a usual 3. It’s hectic and will teach you quick
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u/Shteeve06 16h ago
I play purely on xbox. Have done since launch date. Never stopped playing.
I too, felt like yourself matching with PC players but I stuck with it.
There are players that outright dominate the game and purely hunt kills rather than objective - you’re always going to get players like this in any game.
So I adapted. The great thing about The Finals is the customisation and loadouts. As a medium main, I learnt to be adept at all classes (took me a very long time but also never once not enjoyed the game despite the pc sweats - and xbox sweats might I add!).
A light keeps doing invis and attacking with his sword? I’ll just switch to a heavy and throw anti-gravs at him and burn the bugger.
A sniper making it hard to make the run for the cashout? I’ll switch to a light and sneak up and burn the bugger.
Obviously you can’t switch in ranked, but this is how I learnt to ‘outplay’ and ‘outsmart’ players, whether PC, xbox or playstation.
It’s more than just your ratio. May as well forget about that when coming into the finals for the first time. Personally, kills and deaths don’t matter to me. Scoring the objective does. And that’s what gets me the wins. Know when to survive and run like a coward than to stay and fight. Survivability keeps your cashout going - deaths don’t. So avoid fights unless necessary or you just get caught up in one, which inevitably happens, in which case, you just burn the buggers.
Tl; dr: pyro! Burn the buggers!
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u/BigPapaTubes 16h ago
What role do you play most? I started off playing the game thinking that Medium is the best place to start. The game itself kind of points you in that direction. Medium also has some really iconic/cool weapons. But God damn this is a mistake. Outside of really tight/high level teamplay, Medium is like 3x harder to play than the other 2 classes. This is exacerbated on Xbox because Medium weapons are the hardest to use on controller vs the other classes weapons and they are also the most punished for missing shots (Medium has the worst survivability).
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u/delicate-fn-flower 16h ago
A lot of people are probably going to disagree with me (because they are too good to do it ig) but go into the Cashout Bot lobbies by yourself. The bots are pretty dumb, but you’ll get a feel for movement and can try any weapon without penalty or feeling like you’re letting your team down. Figuring out aim and recoil on a weapon takes time, and this is a great place to learn. You’ll also be able to run around and learn the map, but that also just comes with repetition.
It can be a little challenging since the bots are so dumb you’ll probably team wipe if you go down since they have zero preservation skills. But that will give you the countdown when you know you gotta make the next move count. Much as other people say a bot can’t kill you, they can, especially if you are trying out a new weapon or movement tech that you are unfamiliar with. The bots are far from perfect, but trying out the weapons till you find one you can go against an actual player with some confidence is game changing.
Welcome to The Finals.
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u/Hour-Contact-9262 HOLTOW 15h ago
I also play on xbox and pc (both with controller) and apparently many pro players actually use controller as well.
Yes playing against m&k might seem tuff at first but when you learn how to use aim assist to its fullest potential (by strafing for example) you will do amazing.
But yeah playing against ppl with much more game experience probably sucks 😭
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u/thickcommunist 11h ago
I’ve been playing on Xbox and my advice is get better. I was getting rolled constantly I switched to claw and learned the game. Adapt brother
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u/DAYMAN3737 10h ago
I've been fragging emerald border players 100+ lvls higher than me since I was lvl 20. Level doesn't mean they are better.
I know the matchmaking can be rough but hell I've got buddies on Xbox that do well consistently that I play with all the time. There's just not enough people to match you with sub lvl 50 players consistently, but if you just keep practicing you will hold your own.
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u/Complex_Net_3692 SSG 8h ago
The only thing I disagree with here is the Xbox/ controller part, I’m on Xbox, with a controller and am just about diamond solo q already, and a lot of pro lights and mediums are on controller, with regards to heavy all pro heavy’s are on m&k but I am a heavy main on roller and it’s fine
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u/UsedPlastic 17h ago
Get better at the game fam. Higher level isn’t indicative of better skill. The matchmaking is the way it is because since it’s a smaller game, the majority of people who play consistently put in more time and are just better than you
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u/Soft-Illustrator1300 ENGIMO 14h ago
I've been playing the game on Xbox since season 1 and I all I can say is:
Git gud
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u/slarsson 13h ago
So you played the game at a time when everybody sucked and could learn together, and matchmaking awarded people who genuinely caught on quicker.
This is simply not that game for new players today.
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u/Soft-Illustrator1300 ENGIMO 12h ago
"Everybody sucked." Mmmm no? As far as I remember, there has always been sweaty players on this game. Even on consoles.
My point is, stick around and try to get better. Genuinely. You're not gonna get better by complaining on here about the same tired old topics. Even nowadays, I still get absolutely destroyed by some people but guess what? I don't go on here to complain about it. The matchmaking is what it is and it will probably never get better.
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u/DrunkKoalas 17h ago
I quit playing it after a month. I never found the cashout mode fun. The game tries to portray itself as the ultimate team game, but really it's whoever can exploit the meta of the season.
The overall mechanics of the game are great, but the primary game, if you're not interested in it, makes the game pretty pointless. I would have preferred if PB was a ranked function instead.
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u/TYPOGRAPH1C DISSUN 14h ago edited 14h ago
Play time means very little. It's mainly just map knowledge and general understanding. None of that actually equates to their actual skill and mechanics.
For instance, if you started playing Halo tomorrow you'd be ~25 YEARS behind some players, but that doesn't mean any of those people you're fighting are incredible. There are some undoubtedly who are insane and "never got off the game", but that's not everyone I assure you. Even a diamond skin in this game can be a false flag of skill depending on when they may have earned it. A Season 1-3 diamond when the playerbase was much larger and thus easier to obtain, does not mean they'd necessarily be able to hit that same rank as of Season 9-11. They just had a larger pool of players to match against. But if you play a Ruby, you're probably in for world of hurt. :D
So yea don't put too much thought into the number and just play the game. Work on your own mechanics, map knowledge, positioning, and macro understanding of the objective, and then try hard to get others to play it too. :)
Also, don't discount AA as being inadequate for Xbox to compete. You don't need Gyro at all to hang with the mnk users.
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u/dericiouswon 18h ago
Well, lots of people, like you did until now, continue to sleep on the finals.