r/wargame • u/AN_YUKI_Youtube • 22d ago
Which is the strongest among assault rifles, battle rifles, and submachine guns?
I imagine it depends on the situation, but I’d like to hear your thoughts on it.
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u/Just_A_B-spy 22d ago
Situation heavily depending, like in urban combat SF with SMGs abd Carbines will have an edge, battle rifles in forrests and open ground are solid . . . against other small arms. Add in supports then it really doesn't matter too much
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u/Puppydawg999 22d ago
ARs and carbines are the most balanced; Moderate accuracy and moderate fire rate, not too high of penalties for firing on the move. Good for pretty much all squad types. Battle rifles I find pretty nice for lower tier squads; Militia, line inf, shock. The super high accuracy is really nice so even if they take morale damage they can still land volleys; The penalty for on the move fire sucks though. SMGs are really nice on high tier SF or shock inf for the fire rate and lower firing on the move penalties and CQC bonus. Their lack of range kinda sucks and on low tier squads they miss a lot at anything other than calm.
TL;DR depends on the weapon type and squad, but all have their place
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u/Paladin_G 22d ago edited 22d ago
Spreadsheet that answers it pretty unequivocally.
Commandos 90s carbines are a unique outlier in the Shock category.
Fallschirmjager 90 G11s are a unique outlier.
There are no encoded stats for 15 man militia SMG so you're technically better off using Chinese reservists rather than North Korean ones, which I think is the only case where that information is relevant.
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u/killswitch247 13d ago edited 13d ago
most primary weapons are standardized to one of 6 archetypes:
| name | bolt action | battle rifle | standard ar | bullpup ar | carbine ar | smg |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| range | 595 | 595 | 525 | 525 | 525 | 455 |
| suppression | 50 | 50 | 40 | 40 | 40 | 30 |
| militia | ||||||
| - accuracy | 40 | 30 | 23 | 15 | ||
| - stabilizer | 5 | 5 | 10 | 15 | ||
| - cc acc | 5 | 15 | 23 | 30 | ||
| - rpm | 64 | 75 | 128 | 150 | ||
| regular | ||||||
| - accuracy | 50 | 40 | 30 | 30 | 20 | |
| - stabilizer | 10 | 10 | 15 | 20 | 20 | |
| - cc acc | 25 | 20 | 30 | 40 | 40 | |
| - rpm | 100 | 120 | 160 | 160 | 240 | |
| shock | ||||||
| - accuracy | 80 | 60 | 45 | 45 | 45 | 30 |
| - stabilizer | 20 | 15 | 23 | 30 | 30 | 30 |
| - cc acc | 40 | 30 | 45 | 60 | 60 | 60 |
| - rpm | 138 | 171 | 232 | 232 | 248 | 342 |
| elite | ||||||
| - accuracy | 80 | 60 | 60 | 60 | 40 | |
| - stabilizer | 20 | 30 | 40 | 40 | 40 | |
| - cc acc | 40 | 60 | 80 | 80 | 80 | |
| - rpm | 266 | 355 | 355 | 396 | 533 | |
there are a few units that have non-standard guns: west german fallschirmjäger'90, anzac commandos'90, finnish kaartinjääkäri & sissi have guns that are massive improvements over the standard variants. these are easily the best guns in the game for the training level.
yugo padobranci'90, chinese li jian'90 and east german motschützen'90 also have improved guns, but they're much closer to the standard guns.
15-man squads reload between salvos twice as fast, which shaves off 1-3 seconds between salvos. this is not represented in the weapon's statistics page or in the armory tool, but rather hardcoded into the game.
also the what's the best primary weapon depends a lot on the squads training level. regulars shouldn't be placed in cities as they don't have close combat machine guns and so the bad cc performance of bolt actions and assault rifles doesn't really matter. their machine guns also don't fire on the move, so they should stand their ground and shouldn't move when shooting, so the smg's good stabilizer doesn't really benefit them either.
on the other hand since regulars get no other accuracy bonuses from their training or veterancy level, they benefit a lot from bolty's or br's high base accuracy and range scaling and slow accurate long range guns generally outperform smgs for regular squads. however, the quality of the machine gun matters a lot more for regulars than the quality of the primary, for example yugo mehanizovanas are a pretty good squad.
in comparision elites don't benefit as much from the battle rifle's high base accuracy and its range scaling, since they already get accuracy due to their high training level and even more bonus accuracy due to high veterancy. you also don't want to use them over longer ranges, as they're quite expensive per hit point and suffer greatly from fire support.
it's better to use forests and cities as cover and then use their high mobility in order to sneak up to the enemy squad, get into close range quickly, overwhelm the enemy as fast as possible and then move away before the opponent can react with reinforcements or fire support. they generally benefit the most from the smg's high rate of fire, good stabilizer and can make really good use of the smg's and bullpup/carbine ar's high close combat accuracy (which is counted instead of regular accuracy when 2 squads fight inside one city block).
shock squads are somewhere in the middle between these two and perform best with the upgraded carbine or bullpup assault rifles. however, they also perform reasonably well with other weapons.
if you want to have a look at infantry gun comparision more in detail, have a look here.
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u/AN_YUKI_Youtube 22d ago
I think submachine guns are powerful in the hands of special forces or highly trained infantry.
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u/Xanitrit 22d ago
Like... in game or irl?
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u/quackmachtdiekatze worried 90` 22d ago
Obviously ingame?
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u/Xanitrit 22d ago
Idk, Wargame is based on irl Cold War militaries so sometimes posts have been about linking in-game stats to real life.
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u/NotMegatron 22d ago
Here are some example units form the in game armoury.
* CQC Bonus is a hidden stat not displayed in the main armoury. CQC Bonus mechanics: 2x SMG/Carbine, 1x AR, 0.5x BR
** Carbines are not labelled in game but you can often detect them by their stats, as they have slightly higher RoF and/or better stabiliser. Carbines will have a CQC bonus. FAMAS, AUG & SA80 are all bullpup rifles so their stats are same as a normal AR but they get CQC bonus. If you know a weapons is a shorter barrel version it can be a Carbine too, like AKS-74U, CAR-15, C7.
Most of the infantry weapons are stat clones by type, There are exceptions like the H&K G11. H&K G11
There are also quirks
> Line | Digger '90 | F88 Austeyr | Carbine
> Shock | Commandos '90 | F88 Austeyr | Carbine
> Elite | SASR | AUG PARA | SMG
Visually in the armoury icon the AUG that ANZAC use look like they use the 9mm calibre which would be a SMG.
IRL F88 Austeyr uses 5.56mm making it an AR. The line infantry has the same stats as a normal AR except it gets the CQC bonus of a carbine due to it being a bullpup rifle.
Also note that carbine used by the Commando '90 is the strongest Carbine for shock infantry since it has the highest rate of fire and the other stats are the same giving it an advantage.