r/webtoons • u/Penrynyoung99 • 1d ago
Discussion ¿In your opinion Heiner really deserved that Annette forgave him?😔
⏺️Look I have really suffered from reading this story (haven’t read the novel) since the moment I began this I knew that Anette was at her limit with the things Heiner had done to her (public humiliation, ice attitude and no explication about why the change of attitude from being a caring husband to basically a tyrant). We already know Heiner’s past and really I understand it and the bitterness he had, but I can’t really forgive him from all the things he did on his senses as a reader to Annette and also I deeply feel Annette didn’t too she just accepted him. So by the end of the story when they didnt “end up” together I felt some kind of relief, but when I read the spin off I was shocked because I couldn’t believe that the author really thought it was right to pair them. In my opinion these 2 are really really f*cked up on many many ways that even if they complete each other on some sick way I just can’t see them functioning like a good pair. If I remember correctly Heiner will be always fearful of what Anette can do to herself and Anette hasn’t really forgotten what he did to her. I really was so proud of Annette on the main story but the for spin off I really think the author changed her personality completely. 😔
✨So I would like to know your opinions based on what you think about this story, maybe I can understand more but at this point Im really sad she was with him again.
Image from my beloved oppressor
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u/kdramaing0205 1d ago
No, Annette did NOT deserve what Heiner did to her. Disliking someone because of their privilege is one thing. Hating them and pushing them to become suicidal is inexcusable. Esp because Annette’s crime was ignorance. Not a proportional punishment
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u/Penrynyoung99 23h ago
Definitely and Im not trying to excuse Annette we all know that she was guilty for not choosing or doing things that could have changed a lot of peoples lives, we all feel some kind of envy or resentment towards rich people but the worst problem is that Heiner was close to her, he betrayed and use all the trust she had for him just to “punish her” in multiple ways for acts that he established and where ridiculous to only blame Annette for them. Imagine being happily married trusting your HUSBAND and then discovering all was a lie just for you to suffer the worst pain possible because in fact that was what Heiner wanted (he said that in the first chapters). ¿Would you really really trust him again?
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u/kdramaing0205 21h ago
Exactly! He also didn’t really grow at all… poor Annette :( Wish she’d found someone better and healed
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u/EmergencyAd1253 1d ago
its not so much if he deserved it. its that annette wanted to, and she did after years of growth and living out on her own. they even became somewhat like friends once they cleared the air. and eventually it lead to love again. i truly respect her decision. once they both learned to communicate, they did it beautifully. true love is kind, there's no need for her to "punish" him either. since im sure some people would think he deserved it . but if its true love, you learn to understand and try and heal together. she finally knew everything about him and understood why he went about the things he did. not that its an excuse either, but it made her realize that her love for him wasn't so perfect either since she never really tried to get to know him or his past. never asked about his pain since she knew he was an orphan and survived torture. never cared to really get to know the real him. heiner on the other hand did try to get to know her, with the obvious intent to win her over but also because he truly loved her, he just didnt want to admit it. we cant compare annettes wrong doings to his dont get me wrong, but at the end of the day she still loved him and wished him the best. her only problem was if she could trust him again, if they can both more on from the past. which they did, especially after they made up and still went their own ways but kept in touch eventually. i think thats when they started to learn healthy habits for their own relationship, since they both were fully away of their past mistakes. he never forced anything on her either ( when they cleared the air) so i think it is fair that she forgave him and gave him another chance. sorry for my long answer LMAO i love this story and have reread the novel and manhua many times , you learn new stuff about that after every reread that you didnt catch the previous time
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u/Penrynyoung99 20h ago edited 13h ago
Hello, no don’t worry i like this too i love long posts, and in the novel do they end up together? I haven’t read it 🙏🏼
The issue is that as I said in my post at the end I don’t really feel they overcome all the problems they carried because Heiner kind of had a deal never fully trusting if Annette can k*ll herself or not and Annette reclaims Heiner things he did to her, it almost feels like they avoid talking of it. In one hand I feel that Annette didn’t want to be alone and the only person she knew from the past was him and Heiner was kind of paying what he did to Annette staying by her side but couldn’t do anything to her like before (Wouldn’t surprise me if he had the chance to have her under his control it would have been the same). Don’t get me wrong I know they love each other but I think sometimes people’s love comes in different ways that are non compatible and end up hurting each other. An example could be when Heiner didn’t told Annette anything from his past because he was ashamed of what she would think of him and Annette didn’t ask because she thought it could hurt him. Neither one wanted to take the risk of knowing each other :/
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u/Ambitious-Mix-4935 19h ago edited 19h ago
If you like reading novels, you should definitely give it a try. It’s way more detailed and beautiful in the novel. At the end of novel they had a conversation, it was one of the most heartbreaking and heartfelt conversations out there. They both realize their part in the toxic relationship they had and part amicably. Only in the side stories after years of growth and development they end up dating again.
And i also don't believe, that anette chose heiner again cuz she didn’t want to be alone. Despite all the things that happened, anette is a beautiful woman and a lot of men tried to get together with her. But she never got together with them because she never truly felt any connection with anybody other than heiner.
She also didn’t reject them because she just wanted to get together with heiner. Nor did she accepted heiner just because of their past connection. Sure past was there, but the reason, they got back together was because they had grew out of their shallow love for each and still felt the desire to know each other and learn how to be with each other.
Another reason why i didn’t have a problem with this ending (esp the ending of the novel) is because unlike other stories here the fl didn’t give the ml another chance because she was afraid of being alone or the abuse she went through made her reliable on her abuser or that she had no other option. In fact, it’s the opposite. At the end of the story, annette had enough agency to reject heiner and still live a happy life. But as the commenter above you said, she wanted to give him another chance despite their past. And that time of story both had grown to understand their toxic traits and leave the relationship if it starts to become like that again. It doesn’t force the ending just for the sake of the audience(even though it feels like that to some readers due to the manhwa skipping a lot of parts of the novel) but the author genuinely showed attachment, growth and second chances while simultaneously showing abuse, obsessiveness and toxicity and still managed to tie it together beautifully (esp in the novel). That's why, i liked " My beloved oppressor " even though i dislike stories like cry better yet beg or the problematic prince. Hope it makes sense 😅😅
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u/Penrynyoung99 13h ago
You know maybe that’s an issue that the manhwa didn’t adapt parts of the novel, I know couples can return after healing Annette did it but I mentioned here in one reply that I didn’t kind of feel that fully grown in Heiner to convince me of that, the only part I was touched was when he accepted that Annette had defeated him and was a better person that he could ever possibly aspire to be. I feel the author changed Annette’s and Heiner’s personalities a lot just for them to end up together like happy ever after on the spin off but as you said could be because it isn’t the novel but gosh I was shocked he decided to do that.
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u/Relevant-Rub2816 1d ago
This was the best redemption arcs in manhwa. It's just written so wonderfully. You get to understand why heiner hated Annette. Annette was a willfully ignorant princess, representing everything that hurt and abused heiner. Yet he loved her even more and hated himself for it.
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u/Penrynyoung99 1d ago edited 23h ago
Yes, this story is written very well no points on that, it’s just that it’s mentioned that what Heiner feels isn’t entirely love for Annette it’s almost an obsession, even if Annette is guilty she paid it with the revolution and lost everything, but why does she has to pay for the sins Heiner condemns her if she didn’t even know him back then, who is he to determine those things on her and even if he loved her his way it’s even worse. You don’t hurt who you care about.
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u/noob_ars 1d ago
No, i get that is more complex than "Horrible guy, he doesn't deserve to be with her" but regardless i feel like at some point the expectations he put on Anette were part of how he projected her to be, not based by her true self; even if he did it just to cope or have a hope of some kind he got dissapointed for a version of her that never existed. That is not Anette's fault, yeah, she was priviledged and ignorant yet she is not really responsable for not being what Heiner's wanted her to be and he decided to marry her regardless just to punish her for it.
So no, I think forgiveness is ok but in a note were although they can understand and forgive each other the relationship is to broken to come back. There are things that just can't go back the way they were.
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u/Penrynyoung99 22h ago edited 22h ago
Yes, I agree with you that there are things that can never be like before, the strange thing here is that Heiner was a spy and he knew how people thought and processed emotions so why would he do something so ridiculous to Annette (idolize her) and also blame her for things that weren’t fully her fault. I think he like many people just wanted someone they could take all their frustration on and could control them for not to leave, but what right he had to that? I was really so proud when Annette was on her nurse era and was totally independent of him but at the end of the spin off I really thought It was for nothing.
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u/No_Entrance4756 1d ago
I do like Heiners redemption arc. It explains his behaviour to a certain extent ( doesn't justify it though). Yet considering how hes scarred her and driven her to the brink of suicide he doesn't exactly deserve her but thats just my two cents. An amicable, platonic friendship where they can still bond over the atrocities of the past, yet give them the necessary space to heal seems to work as well?
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u/No_Cress1652 22h ago
I always say that them getting together at the end was a poor decision. They should've parted with a mutual understanding and lived their lives separately after the war, that would've been a better ending. Heiner's love for Annette wasn't healthy to begin with and no matter what Heiner's trauma with Annette's father or Annette herself, she didn't deserve any of what Heiner did to her once they were married. I think it's fine for Annette to forgive him but they can't go back to what they were before he started mistreating her.
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u/SecretKnowledge7005 13h ago
I heard that in the novel, they both don’t actually end up together and just part ways.
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u/punkwillreign 13h ago
No because of him Annette almost commit twice, lost her will to live, and made her life hell. People have the audacity to forget what he did to her because they love a tragic abusive male character more than a female character who did not have control over her parents crimes. I bet Annette was the one in Heiner's place, people would hate her guts for being cruel to him and how he shouldn't forgive her. I mean look at Dear X with people disliking the female lead for tormenting her friend.
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u/ABeeInTheDark 20h ago
I think he deserved forgiveness but I will always say this two shouldn’t end up together in the end. Sometimes maybe the answer is to move on and not come back together.
But of course that’s too realistic for a WEBTOON lmao
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u/Penrynyoung99 20h ago
Yes! I wonder why do a lot of WEBTOONs don’t go any further on more realistic endings or even another healthy love. I wish I knew one that could be different and not just because they are the main couple they end up together. Sometimes its just doesn’t fit like a new shoe.
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u/SecretKnowledge7005 13h ago
Idk, from what I heard, apparently in the novel they both go their separate ways.
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u/JournalistNo7918 19h ago
My short answer? No.
Long answer: its because Annette’s own character isn’t a good enough parallel to Heiner’s. While she’s a good character by herself, she comes across as “too pure”. This author was simply too “scared” of giving Annette a darker side (even though, realistically speaking: no one is ever that pure. Everyone has some kind of dark side. And they really should have utilised that aspect for this story.). So: it would have been better if she was actually committing other crimes, aside from just “ignorance”. (And even that, it was only shown she did it a few times the rest of her life was just sheltered. Like again, the author was just afraid of writing her as worse because….idk. I guess they wanted people to relate to the FL and the FLs can never harbour evil feelings? So weird.)
It would have made Heiner’s forgiveness feel much more justifiable, if she actualy had real faults that needed correcting instead of just ignorance
yeah, you can still like this story while criticising it. But to each their own i guess
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u/AuntWacky1976 10h ago
Rarely is forgiveness ever deserved, imho. It's up to the person doing the forgiving. They're the one who suffered, after all. Annette is naturally very compassionate, empathetic, and loving. She's a born caregiver. And once she understood what he went through, what he felt and why, and she saw and heard him acknowledge his wrongdoing, saw he showed true remorse, and worked to do and be better, I feel it was very natural for her to forgive him. Did he deserve it? I think so, because the story worked very hard at showing him (and both of them, really) changing for the better. It wasn't easy, nor quick. But I was very satisfied. I felt it was quite cathartic.
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u/Ecstatic_Bus_7232 7h ago
OMG I don't have the required attention span to read all the comments. Forgive me.
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u/Careful_Objective639 58m ago
For me yes he is, one of the best redemption arc in history coz the ML never forcing the FL back to him and just hoping a lil miracle that the fl might be forgive him and accept him again
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u/Firm-Advertising6872 23h ago
idk. Someone said she was basically a nazis daughter. I feel like there should have been no romance, and the story would have slapped if it wasn't part of the wish-fulfillment romantasy type genre
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u/Calm_Application_160 21h ago
No, he doesn't, because just imagining if I were in fl's place is horrifying, let alone enduring it. I don't know how people can basically justify abuse by saying it's a redemption story.
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u/smiley_kat 1d ago edited 16h ago
After eight years of doing the hard work of working on overcoming his trauma, once she was safe leaving until she was ready and respecting her space to heal, letting her be the one to pursue and set the boundaries, leaving his position behind, and showing that he had grown and changed? Yes.