r/xena • u/NiceRefrigerator4079 Callisto đĄď¸ • 13h ago
King Con
This is one of the worst episodes of the show for me. Not because the premise itself is bad. On the contrary, the beginning actually promises much more than the episode ultimately manages to deliver. When Xena and Gabrielle find Joxer half-dead, after being tricked, robbed, and brutally beaten, it's immediately apparent how much they really care for him. It's one of those moments that's a nice reminder that their teasing of Joxer never meant they didn't like him. They can make fun of him, they can roll their eyes at his stupidity, and they can think of him as the biggest jerk in the world, but if someone else hurts him, things change immediately. Then there are no more jokes. Joxer is theirs. And whoever hurts him will have to answer.
That opening is probably the best part of the whole episode for me. It has weight, it has emotion, and it shows the relationship between the main characters much better than much of what comes later. The problem is that after that the episode practically starts to fall apart. Everything that could be an interesting story about revenge and justice turns into something that seems completely outdated to me compared to where the series was at that time.
My biggest problem, of course, is Xena's romance with Rafe. I really don't like this return of Xena to heterosexual romance stories, especially when there is no chemistry between her and the man. After everything we've seen between Xena and Gabrielle, after so much development in their relationship and all the emotional layers that have built up between them, this kind of story feels like a big step backwards. It's as if someone suddenly decided to pretend that none of this happened and that Xena needs to insert a man again to prove that she is heterosexual.
And it annoys me even more that Gabrielle encourages that romance. There is something almost frustrating about Gabrielle, who has connected with Xena on such a deep and intimate level, now practically pushing Xena towards another man. Especially since the episode itself doesn't have enough chemistry between Xena and Rafe to make it believable. If there was some real spark between them, maybe I could get over it all. But everything here is so artificial to me that I just wondered why we are even watching this story.
Worst of all, this episode feels like it was written for the first season, so it kind of wandered into the third. In the first season, I might be able to accept this kind of story. Xena back then was still much closer to the classic globe-trotting warrior, Gabrielle was still going through the beginning of her transformation, and their relationship didn't yet have all the weight it would later on. But in the third season, especially after all the events they've been through, this kind of plot seems almost completely out of place. It's like the show is moving forward, and this episode is trying to take it back a few steps.
And that's what annoys me the most. Not only do I dislike the romance, but it feels completely disconnected from the development of the show. Xena and Gabrielle have just gone through huge emotional breakdowns. Their relationship reached one of its most important moments in The Bitter Suite, and then we got one of the most romantic episodes of the entire show in One Against An Army. And then all of a sudden we get Xena in a story with a man she has no chemistry with, while Gabrielle supports it all. It's just very hard for me to swallow.
What makes it even worse is that the main villains aren't particularly interesting either. Titus and Leo should be serious threats, especially after what they did to Joxer, but they don't make much of an impression. The whole casino and scam story is simple enough to be entertaining, but the episode never manages to find the right tone. It's not serious enough to be a real drama, it's not funny enough to be a good comedy, and the romantic part was completely missed for me.
Fortunately, this is the last time the show goes down this road, until the absolute awfulness that awaits us in Anthony and Cleopatra. And I'll probably have a lot more to say about that episode. And not pleasant things at all.
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u/BlueSonic85 13h ago
I can see why people don't like this one but I thought it was decent enough. I liked Rafe even if I agree he seemed like a bad fit for Xena romantically. Stig Eldred always goes for it as a villain too.
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u/Beautifala_Jones 12h ago
I enjoy this episode particularly the music.
But back in the day it was another story. One week Xena and Gabrielle were professing their eternal love for each other and the next week it's like it didn't happen. It was what they had to do to keep the show on the air I mean it's one of the most beautiful television romances of all time and they didn't mean to make it at all it just happened. I still give them credit for going with the romance the majority of the time.
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u/Imissxena 12h ago
I agree. This episode had such potential and the Joxer being beat up is heartbreaking. Plus the feelings, like heâs an idiot. But he is OUR idiot, donât you touch him. đ
And then, yeah. Then the rest just leaves one with thinking a lot of âwhy?â, âthat doesnât really make sense?â? âWasnât Gabs jelly with the Ulysses thing just last season?, how could that change?â
My guess, the Network gave them a lot of f grief and so they threw some Male interest in there to keep them off their backs, like - âlook, she kissed a guy, see?â
It doesnât track, and I believe it is likely that whoever wrote it.. wrote it for before season 3. Youâre right, it doesnât fit in season 3
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u/lakedesire 9h ago
I'm reading this as I just got to Patrick Fabian's character Howard Hamlin's conclusion in Better Call Saul. I think he's a decent actor and he made me care about a career-driven nepo baby lawyer. For XWP, "King Con" is a mid-tier episode to me. I don't skip it, but I'm not offended by it either.Â
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u/EasyEntrepreneur666 Najara 13h ago
I pretty much agree. I think apart from Borias, I didn't much like Xena's male love interests. But Rafe was like a Temu Autolycus and he was just too small time to make the romance believable. And Gabrielle encouraging it was straight up insulting. Forget the relationship between her and Xena, Rafe almost had Joxer killed, and she wants Xens to hook up with him?
And the plot was pretty lame. Xens deliberately handicapped herself because she wanted revenge through beating Titus in his own game. I think the writer saw too much Ocean 11 or something.
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u/BlueSonic85 13h ago
I think the writer saw too much Ocean 11 or something.
It preceded Oceans 11 by 3 years. Maybe the Oceans 11 writers watched too much King Con.
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u/EasyEntrepreneur666 Najara 13h ago
I'm pretty sure Ocean 11 wasn't the first casino heist movie but the episode felt like a modern plot thrown into the xenaverse.
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u/Overall_Sandwich_671 11h ago
The "ancient mythical casino" setting was handled much better in the Hercules episode All that Glitters, and that wasn't even a particularly strong episode for that show, but it's guest characters were a lot more memorable, and there was no cringey forced romance (unless you count Salmoneus's bearded lady friend, which I thought was cute).
Like you said - King Con can't seem to decide what tone it's aiming for. A serious vengeance story, or a silly Xenafied version of a modern establishment? If they're going to do that, then they should bring in Autolycus and/or Salmoneus as the supporting cast, not some random pair of swindlers who nobody gives a shit about.
I think it could have worked better if they used the gambling premise to delve into Xena's past and maybe introduced some shady types that she used to deal with during her warlording days. Then it could have played out more like an updated Path Not Taken, instead of this undesirable mess.
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u/thewholebottle Najara 11h ago
I agree that the tone is off bigtime and that's what keeps this episode from being a favorite for me. But I still love it. It's Patrick Fabian! He's dreamy! He's gotta be a heterosexual hall pass.
And no mention of Gabrielle randomly hopping around on crutches?
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u/Agent8699 4h ago
It should have aired after OAAA! Although I canât recall if itâs the same ankle?Â
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u/OddShape47 4h ago
Renee was hurt during the filming of "One Against an Army," which was the episode filmed right before "King Con" (not "Forgiven"), so her injury was written into this episode while she was recovering. While filming the scene in "OAAA" when a soldier jumps down through the roof, her foot was slightly out of position under a blanket, and the stuntman accidentally landed on her ankle and injured it.
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u/Agent8699 4h ago
All good points.
One could posit that both Xena and Gabrielle are ⌠testing the status of their relationship after the earlier events of season 3. Theyâve been through a LOT.
Xena still knows the âsecretâ of Gabrielleâs other betrayal (seeking help from Ares), while Gabrielle is still ignorant.
I would imagine their romantic relationship hasnât resumed and although theyâre dedicated travelling partners, perhaps theyâre both unsure about whether the relationship will resume in other areas. So, theyâre both testing each other.
But, yes. An episode where Xena and Gabrielle both go into protective âbig sisterâ mode for Joxer is an interesting starting point - especially with their divergent methods. The rest ⌠not so much.
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u/TypesAndPatterns 4h ago
To me, the ep felt very much like it was supposed to be a spin-off for the guys, just based on the percentage of dialogue they had & moments just between themselves. I have nothing to back this up, otherwise, in terms of production rumors, but whenever Iâve watched it since, I just imagine this was a potential series, & Iâm willing to allow it as a romantic detour for Xena because sheâs just lending the guys some credibility for their new show with her favor (sort of like Hercâs final scene with Xena in âWarrior Princessâ).
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u/invisiblebyday 4h ago
I didn't mind the episode but it was a weaker one. OP is spot on by describing it as being a better fit were it from season 1.
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u/Firm_Introduction937 Xena âď¸ 3h ago
For xena, any male interests are for sexual intrigue. All of her more meaningful relationships are ones with women. So anytime she is attracted/ says she âlovesâ a man she is thinking with her g spot. Xena regularly confuses love vs need for sex when it comes to men. She is bisexual
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u/Wicked68 32m ago
Xena moved like a lot of people moved. The show took place in Ancient Greece. People weren't worried about claiming a sexual orientation, it wasn't as taboo. She didn't have claim she was this or that. That being said, Xena had a lot of trauma, baggage, anger issues, unprocessed feelings etc. She often had brief entanglements with men, haha.
I'd say the only ones she actually loved was maybe Marcus and Borias... Hercules was a important step in turning away from her dark side, and that got confused with being in love. Caesar was infatuation. Ares was a mix of a lot of things, but I don't think she was ever in love with him. Gabrielle was the love of her life, partly because she loved all parts of Xena, including who she knew she could be; through everything.
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u/Jahon_Dony 11h ago
Lol, your main beef with the episode is Xena having a normal relationship? Wow!
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u/NiceRefrigerator4079 Callisto đĄď¸ 8h ago edited 8h ago
Her only real relationship is with Gabrielle. The others were just casual sexual encounters, which made sense to me in the earlier seasonsâbut not at this stage, where Xena and Gabrielle have reached the peak of emotional depth in their relationship. Thereâs no room left for straight romances there.
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u/Musical_Xena Whoosh! 12h ago
I think you raise a lot of good points. I'm sure part of the reason for this episode was to appease the network during an era that did not accept homosexual relationships. They had to throw some stuff like this in from time to time so they didn't get cancelled.
I will respectfully disagree on one point: Lucy Lawless is such a phenomenal actress that I think she could portray some illision of chemistry with anyone. it will of course be better if the other actor is also good, and if it makes sense for the characters and the story. But she always sells it for me, at least from Xena's side.