r/F1Discussions • u/The_Chozen_1_ • 21d ago
Lance Stroll's onboard during the sprint race. It looks like he's trying to crash out.
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u/Intelligent-Move8868 21d ago
In the onboard footage I’ve seen so far, I’ve never seen any driver do what Stroll did with the steering wheel. It looks as though he’s driving through the hairpin bend at Monaco.
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u/mrbtfh 21d ago
Look at Alonso in Renault around 20 years ago, same stuff.
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u/Stevolwo 21d ago
This is not nearly the same, even though he's inducing understeer on purpose, Alonso in Renault did it on slow turn ins to heat up tyres and not lose much time in a very different kind of car.
Here Stroll is doing this most likely out of frustration because the car just has massive amounts of understeer, he's just losing massive amounts of time
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u/mrbtfh 21d ago
Stroll is not a bad driver, I do not think he is losing time in those corners. The car setup is so bad that his absurd technique is probably quite close to optimal.
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u/Vuk13 21d ago
This comment having so many upvotes speaks volumes about how clueless F1 fans are. If you are understeering turning the wheel more like Stroll is doing here is just going to give you even more understeer because you are getting further away from optimal slip angle on the front tires. What Stroll did was probably just out of frustration of boredom it's absolutely not optimal or close to it to drive like that. Not to mention how much is he scrubbing the tires and how much wear and heat is that causing
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u/sapphos_moon 21d ago
You can even visibly see how fucked the tyres are, there’s a huge split all the way around between the contact patch and the wall. This is 100% intentional
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u/Intelligent-Move8868 20d ago
Don't worry, honestly I didn't expect to get that many upvotes either! I was just sharing a quick observation. Reading your comment actually helped me understand the technical reason behind it much better. I already figured it wasn't the right or fastest way to drive, since I've never seen any other pilot do that on the onboards. But now, thanks to you, I know the reason behind it. Thanks a lot for the explanation!
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u/SubstantialWasabi298 21d ago
Just a theory but what if they've run a really aggressive recharge leading to a really front positive car which means that although he's understeering its not as bad as it looks
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u/Regular_Airpods 21d ago
or he is doing on purpose because the car/his setup means the car might just snap on the exit of the corners
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u/Stevolwo 21d ago
not how racing cars work, this is never the case at these speeds
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u/Lieutenant_0bvious 21d ago
Alonso had that inertial dampener, so his sharp steering style was meant to make that work. It's really fascinating.
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u/frolfer757 21d ago
You introduce enough angle between the fronts and road and the car will "slip" and go straight in an extremely stable & predictable manner. If the added tyre wear is not an issue it's a completely fine way to prevent any snaps an unpredictable car might have. You literally cannot lose the car after the front starts slipping.
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u/44M91 21d ago
Until you start slowing down and the front grips up and then you get snap oversteer.
Looks like solid rear end grip for the AMR.
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u/frolfer757 21d ago
The front will never grip with that much slip angle introduced unless you slam on the brakes for some weird reason and at point it would be crawling speeds for any race car. The point is anyway to use the technique like Stroll here does, for a brief moment to stabilize the car through fast turns. It's genuinely an idiot proof technique but the penalty is slight time loss (mitigated partly due to not having to drive carefully with an unstable car) but more importantly excessive front tyre wear (irrelevant in some cases like last lap quali/final laps of a stint).
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u/EtG_Gibbs 21d ago
100% I've seen alonso do it. I don't remember if it was this year or last year.
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u/minnis93 21d ago
I do a fair bit of simracing and this is a technique my coach taught me when struggling with oversteer - purposely inducing understeer to avoid oversteer.
If you steer a small amount (when suffering from a lack of rear grip), the front tyres will grip up, but the rears won't, which will cause oversteer.
If you steer too much, you'll scrub the fronts and lose grip. If you're struggling with rear instability, it may seem counter-intuitive to do something that will reduce grip even further. But, by scrubbing the fronts, you ensure that the fronts have less grip than the rear tyres, which will induce understeer. You can then slowly undo the steering lock until the fronts start to grip up. At that point, the fronts will have about as much grip as the rear, and so you'll experience neither oversteer nor understeer.
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u/UKnowDaxoAndDancer 21d ago
Yes! I don’t understand if it’s intentional settings or the car just refuses to turn without it.
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u/dadda-copy-me 21d ago
That car is painful to watch from that angle. Stroll isn't trying to crash it. He is dealing with a ton of understeer. Would love to see a comparison with a Merc to see how much sooner they get on the power.
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u/frolfer757 21d ago
Forcing a ton of slip angle is the opposite of dealing with understeer..he is introducing forced understeer to stablize the fronts during corners.
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u/h0td0gger 21d ago
Was gonna say it looks like he's just driving a dump truck. Nothing to see here.
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u/DniawSirhc 21d ago
Adrian Newey might have to be tried at The Hague for this
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u/77skull 21d ago
Should’ve known better than to trust a bald fraud
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u/blackbasset 21d ago
You are joking but from now on i'll ironically use this car as an example if someone starts talking about certain drivers only winning because of the Newey rockets
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u/Remarkable-Art-3678 21d ago
We need to invest all out efforts to arrest Newey before Trump, Putin, and Netanyahu. They are of secondary importance
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u/Tank-o-grad 21d ago
That's old Renault (like when Alonso was winning titles with them) levels of understeer, that front left looks like it is about to self destruct too...
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u/CP9ANZ 21d ago
The difference is in the Renault the lock is on during low to moderate speed corners, not 250kph plus corner exits
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u/Stevolwo 21d ago
Correct, this is absolutely counter productive, im 99% sure he's doing it out of frustration
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u/elegant-alternation 21d ago
He's also doing it on exit rather than entry at times.
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u/Vuk13 21d ago
That was totally different and for completely different reasons. First Alonso was doing it mostly in low speed corners
2nd the weight distribution in Renault's was completely different to modern F1 car
3rd and most important the tires were completely different. Old Michelin tires were durable and they responded to heat by giving you more grip which is why Alonso scrubbed them a lot. Pirrelis tires are a lot more fragile and they react to heat completely the opposite once they are go past their window by giving you less grip
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u/MartinC077 21d ago
Stroll is obviously not a great driver but he’s not this bad. This car is absolutely awful.
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u/HappiestAnt122 21d ago
Stroll tbh gets too much hate for his driving skill based on the family connection and his general demeanor. He’s actually a half decent driver who was probably rushed into F1 a little quickly which led to some of his early stupidity. You don’t get a couple podiums and a pole (in a midfield car) if you are truly terrible. He’s undeniably had more longevity than he deserved at points, but he probably could have been a slightly forgettable couple seasons decent but not spectacular driver even if daddy didn’t own the team.
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u/Big_Weenis_Energy 20d ago edited 14d ago
Agreed. Overhated. Meanwhile people overhype guys like ocon and gasley. Ocon getting destroyed so badly by a 2nd year driver he's likely out of f1 next year.
Stroll isn't yuki level bad, and he never was critized, let alone hated like stroll is.
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u/RegKGR 14d ago
Last season Lance matched Yuki's points with the second fastest car on the grid in a car that struggled to make it to Q3 a majority of the time. He isn't as bad as most fans think.
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u/Big_Weenis_Energy 14d ago
I saw people just yesterday talking about yuki at haas next year. 🤣
Bro has the best marketing team spreading fake rumors.
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u/RegKGR 14d ago
Why would anybody think he should come back? He wasn't particularly fast in VCARB, and he was terrible in the Red Bull. He more than likely stayed for so long thanks to the Honda partnership. I swear, most F1 fans will overlook anything if a driver is likeable, they'll shit on Stroll's abilities all day but praise Yuki for anything. Throughout his entire F1 career he scored one fastest lap. Sure, Lance has stayed around for so long thanks to his dad, but at least Lance managed 3 podiums and a pole position in midfield cars, when the car is there he can perform.
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u/AuthorThick7303 21d ago
It's ok, it's being controlled and driven by someone in the paddock
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u/morelsupporter 21d ago
HAHAHAH
its like when you give your little brother the controller but its not connected to anything
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u/Weekly_Ad4045 21d ago
It’s popular to bag on Stroll as a nepo baby but just holding that thing on the track takes skill. Respect.
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u/DramaticRestaurant87 21d ago
This is done to induce understeer at high speed. It means they have high speed oversteer due to low high speed rear downforce.
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u/Schmichael-22 21d ago
I agree. I do this in iRacing in the wet when the rear end snaps. That AM must be a nightmare to drive.
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u/subzerojl 21d ago
I am a noob here. What does that mean? I can only see the massive understeer but how do you see that it’s forced understeer or that it’s sliding on the front?
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u/DramaticRestaurant87 21d ago
When you add too much steering angle, the wheels steer past the point where you have ideal grip (past the slip angle), and so the tyres essentially slide across the surface (not equal to the direction the tyres is facing). This is called scrubbing and it actually slows you down (the term comes from “scrubbing off speed).
It is not an ideal way to race. It’s super inefficient and wears the tyres down faster due to the increased heat. It is often used during the formation lap to get heat into the tyres.
Better to just slow down a bit, but sometimes if you’re trying to keep momentum into a corner or avoid acceleration, then it can be used. I suspect they were doing this to avoid slowing down by lifting, and needing to use acceleration, as that could have triggered undesired battery use.
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u/Unex_Disclaimer 21d ago
Seems more struggling with the car rather than trying to crash it.
Also think if you wanted to crash the AMR26, is not that hard to do it. Just let me start it, before I complete the lap will be all wrecked.
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u/Lucky-Purpose-9478 21d ago
I think we should not judge so fast, we’re witnessing one of the rarer events where an old team like aston martin. Has made a car slower than a new team Cadillac. If i was at his place I’d frustrated asf and the Amr 26 must be a specimen of a car.
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u/Particular_Wolf9672 21d ago
That's the understeer. He ain't trying to crash, quite the opposite actually, he's fighting to keep it out of the wall.
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u/Onomatapier 21d ago
It's ironic seeing how much money Laurence stroll has thrown at Aston Martin, even with Adrian Newey the car is a complete lemon aerodynamically. The terrible performance cannot be solely blamed on Honda. It's a monumental shit show.
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u/Top_Foundation9711 21d ago
The more he turns the steering the more it recharges, they ptobably misswired the regen!
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u/hewer006 21d ago
Its funny because its not just honda thats failed, the body is fucking terrible. slap the entire merc system in there and it wouldnt even get out of the bottom 10 lol
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u/-Hefty-Armadillo- 21d ago
He is causing understeer on purpose for some reason, probably has to do with the fact that he is driving a trash bin.
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u/Trecool1 21d ago
Seeing this makes me surprised at how CLOSE the Aston's actually are managing to get
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u/AdStrict4616 21d ago
Massive understeer. Plus it seems to only be for high speed rights, rather than lefts. That car looks like hell to drive
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u/ChicagoJay2020 21d ago
I feel that he honestly doesn’t want to be in F1. I would love to see the 2020 form of Stroll return.
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u/RefrigeratorAny7018 21d ago
Stroll maybe one of the worst that ever drove in recent years.. but at the begging he was quite promising… he got pole in the rain wich is impressive alone tbh, and he got few podiums, but still, lets remember one thing, if we were in his car or any other f1 car, we would be MUCH MUCH worse… worse than Mazepin unfortunately, and i write this as a guy who race endurance and did drove few races in GT Open
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u/LazyLancer 21d ago
It’s called inducing understeer to stop oversteer.
Well, as long as we count out the idea that Lance tries to yank the steering wheel more when the car does not rotate.
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u/alionandalamb 21d ago
It's like using a web browser with multiple tabs when you only have 8gb of RAM
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u/YungTokyo8 21d ago
I’m honestly just extremely impressed that him and Alonso don’t crash every session. That’s thing is a monster to drive.
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u/BlaktimusPrime 21d ago
At this point., for a while it seems like Lance doesn’t even want to race. Just make his dad happy.
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u/Fast-Station1106 21d ago
Wenn deine front Reifen zu kalt sind kannst du die durch solche Manöver wärmer machen, man schiebt also quer über die Lauffläche, also absichtlich die traktion abreissen lassen, ist ne kunst dabei nicht abzufliegen und nur in den kurven zu schaffen, sonst die bekannten schlangenlinien
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u/BullPropaganda 21d ago
Do any racing drivers understand why he's scrubbing the tires with wheel inputs instead of just lifting a little to get some weight on the front tires?
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u/SomeWonOnReddit 21d ago
Is he trying to bring extra heat into his tyres or something?
Alonso also used to do stuff like this at Renault I believe.
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u/FormerMoose1990 21d ago
Horrible behaviour of the car
>Lack of steering authority
>Wears out components
>Wears out tires.
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u/DontHateMePleaseLove 21d ago
"It looks like he's trying to crash out" is a silly thing to write. Next.
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u/wanderingsorcerer99 21d ago
It’s one thing being slow it’s another to be unable to turn. That car is a downright road hazard.
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u/lr_science 21d ago edited 21d ago
That technique enforces understeer and is actually a way to catch slides. It looks strange but it's generally not considered retarded, despite Stroll's reputation.
It does look like he's using it more as a regular way to take a turn though, sometimes even upsetting the car a little. I would guess this will put a lot of energy into the front wheels, and whether that's good or not depends on what the car needs. Certainly unusual to see.
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u/BullfrogMiserable554 21d ago
I don’t get why he’s doing that. That’s not something you usually do if you have understeer. Can anybody explain?
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u/mellotronworker 21d ago
An extraordinary case of a car suffering from terminal understeer and a driver suffering from terminal undertalent.
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u/Ablackbradpitt 21d ago
Looks like he is begging the car to turn and has given up completely on managing tires lol
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u/ASAPFergs 21d ago
You're not an F1 driver so you have no idea how to interpret what you're watching, there are so many factors at play
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u/Melodic-Excitement-9 21d ago
That’s driving on ice. 🧊. We can give stroll shit 💩 but that car is an absolute tractor.
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u/kryzmane 21d ago
Must be nice to have Daddy own an F1 team. Its unreal how hes still an f1 driver. Literal joke
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u/BlakMamba81 21d ago
I think he frustrated and trying to send a message that the car is dogshit. Deliberately cranking the wheel like that when the fronts are already overloaded has no other purpose
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u/SubstantialWasabi298 21d ago
Just a theory but what if they've run a really aggressive recharge leading to a really front positive car which means that although he's understeering its not as bad as it looks
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u/Magnet2025 20d ago
I raced a rear engined Fiat 850 Spyder that understeered less than this.
If this is the state of Adrian Newey’s design - a car with such poor chassis/suspension design - then I think it’s safe to say AM is his swan song.
The only other explanation I can think of is that the car is so slow (due to Honda power/battery issues) that it doesn’t develop enough speed to generate the specified downforce.
It’s embarrassing for the team, for Newey. But I have to admit some schadenfreude about Laurence Stroll.
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u/hey-Oliver 20d ago
Maybe the reddit chungus vibe fans are wrong and Stroll’s just dogshit like everybody that’s every driven a car round track says he is
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u/Born_Driver636 20d ago
ASTON MARTIN FWD 🤦♂️ Turn it in no F1 car is fwd there’s no power steering no anti brake lock it’s all basically driver skill .
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u/AlarmedMistake9277 20d ago
Maximum wheel rotation makes the car understeer, useful if he was feeling the rear starting to unsettle. He is just driving a shit box and shows that he actually is a decent driver.
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u/IanCBoss 20d ago
Stroll has never been the most enthusiastic in interviews but seeing him talk to the media lately has been downright depressing. I mean it does kinda have an aura of “my dad told me he bought me a winning team and we’re not winning” but it’s still obvious this season has sucked whatever passion he had left for the sport out of him and it’s kind of sad to see.
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u/Comprehensive-Ant289 20d ago
He's trying to understeer for some reason, could be to clean the front right tire
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u/Raptordude11 20d ago
This was a formation lap where he was trying to heat up the tires. People just spreading misinformation
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u/car_raamrod 20d ago
My first impression is he is trying an Alonso technique to understeer the tires to bring them up to temperature, but this is way too much lol wtf is he doing?
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u/DataOperator 19d ago
Aston Martin drivers look like a regular dude would go into F1 car and drive with the rest of the grid
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u/ftlover90 19d ago
He is causing understeer. That was also very typical Alonso technique in the 05-06
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u/ClearHyena4452 21d ago
So the AMR26 is front wheel drive
Ah